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Post by wayseer on Nov 25, 2007 22:45:10 GMT
Russell - I think I can understand.
But this -
Two of the symptoms of transcending meditation are rapid passage of time and a sense of "where was I?"
... has me struggling.
If one does 'transcend' meditation how would one know (sense) rapid passages of time or a 'sense' of 'where was I?
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Post by hollandr on Nov 26, 2007 0:59:04 GMT
>how would one know (sense) rapid passages of time
A typical experience is to open the eyes after about 10 minutes and discover that more than 30 minutes have passed. The inner process involves the awareness moving into frequencies that the brain is currently unable to record - hence gaps in time
>a 'sense' of 'where was I?
Sometimes when returning from meditation one has been so far away that it takes a little while to readjust to the physical world and to recover a contextual memory - for example of what is the next task in the day
There are supposedly 120 types of transcending meditation based on:
- five senses - active and passive modes - the 3 gunas - some other factor I cannot recall
Cheers
Russell
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Post by Antonius on Nov 26, 2007 10:09:01 GMT
is that real time being longer then percieved time a consistant effect? perhaps what it means is that the brain is opwerating on a lower frequency. if you slow down to 50mhz wile being used to percieving time in 100mhz, then u will find an our in experiance = half an hour realtime.
have u ever experianced the opposite?
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Post by hollandr on Nov 26, 2007 22:03:25 GMT
>is that real time being longer then percieved time a consistant effect?
Well it is pretty common when meditating at a regular time in a suitable place
>perhaps what it means is that the brain is opwerating on a lower frequency. if you slow down to 50mhz wile being used to percieving time in 100mhz,
It may be worth considering if the consciousness can be independent of the brain. If so, then it may operate without brain record for some time
And there are many accounts of people having out of the body experiences so that they consider that their consciousnesses are independent of their bodies
And in the ancient mysteries that was the primary experience of the 3rd degree. After that the initiate had no need to fear death - as consciousness continued without a body
>have u ever experianced the opposite?
That is a less common experience - but still there are many accounts of conscious experience of the Silence that appear to be much longer than the physical reality
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Post by maat on Nov 26, 2007 23:06:50 GMT
It may be worth considering if the consciousness can be independent of the brain. If so, then it may operate without brain record for some time Anesthetics produce this 'no time' passing experience. Interesting to note that even anesthetists do not know precisely how anesthetics work, but gifted people will tell you that the substances drive the consciousness temporily out of the body. Maat
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Post by hollandr on Nov 26, 2007 23:54:50 GMT
>substances drive the consciousness temporily out of the body.
The displacement of the etheric body from the physical makes it easy to bite the cheek or tongue after a dental anesthetic - as the physical part is not quite where the etheric expects it
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Post by Antonius on Nov 27, 2007 4:03:43 GMT
And there are many accounts of people having out of the body experiences so that they consider that their consciousnesses are independent of their bodies right... and with this holgram thing im obsessing over, its that they are both reflections of a single thing, and by loosing the body one simply can no longer manifest in this particular dimention, and conciousness shifts to another level. but still, conciousness does often experiance a sensation of the passage of time, so it could be fair to say it works at a slower rate then it would in a non meditative state. That is a less common experience - but still there are many accounts of conscious experience of the Silence that appear to be much longer than the physical reality in shamanic states this is actualy the more common experiance, and in extreme shamanic states people experiance a total ambiguity of time. perhaps time exists only in the physical, and we experiance it in the altered state as a restriction imposed by the physical body. perhaps this is why some things seem to help the process along, like bineural beats, sensory deprivation, exhaustion, raising of body heat and certain chemicals. perhaps it is because these things have an effect on the way we experiance the physical body that makes it easyer for the spirit to not be distracted by it. anyways altered states comes with altered brain activity and chemistry, and so what the spirit does without the body does have its representation in brain activity and chemistry etc. in my view a reflection of sorts. perhaps if the brain is caused to do something different and these other processes conflict with the ones reflecting the spiritual activity, the ego tries to override it and subject conciousness to the body again... anyways all if this makes me think that to know a thought is realy your own, the only way is to see if it is truely reflected in the heart. thoughts are not a product of conciousness, they are our brain's translation of the symbolic language of conciousness. people can lern to speak the symbolic language of conciousness and become more adept at translating the messege. they can also use their skill to feed ideas to the subconcious, and a person who does not know his heart can easily think the resulting thought was his own. consider this: the view on all tv's on 9-11 showed an image of towers being hit by objects from the sky and then the towers burning. this is identical to the tower card in tarot, wich stands for disaster and conflict in its basic meaning. either conciously or instinctively the people who planned that attack knew this image would have a profound effect on the people who saw it, the very effect they were looking for. there is a black magic practice that knows all about speaking symbols to the subconciouss, and they have been conducting their evil satanic rituals out in the open for decades. im talking offcourse about marketing. marketing is all about speaking to the subconciouss in symbolic language to manipulate people into doing what you want them to do instead of what they want to do. like buy stuff they dont need with money they dont have, vote for politicians they dont believe in and eat things they ordinarily wouldnt feed their dog.
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Post by maat on Nov 27, 2007 5:45:32 GMT
this is identical to the tower card in tarot, which stands for disaster and conflict in its basic meaning. You may find this of interest to you Antonius. The Tarot Tower... www.medtarot.freeserve.co.uk/letter16.htmCheers Maat
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Post by wayseer on Nov 27, 2007 6:14:26 GMT
the view on all tv's on 9-11 showed an image of towers being hit by objects from the sky and then the towers burning. this is identical to the tower card in tarot, wich stands for disaster and conflict in its basic meaning. either conciously or instinctively the people who planned that attack knew this image ...
I think you are guessing. My guess is that Moslems would not be into Tarot.
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Post by hollandr on Nov 27, 2007 10:48:38 GMT
>My guess is that Moslems would not be into Tarot.
John
My understanding is that public opinion surveys in the US indicate that around half of the population does not believe the official version of 9-11.
If you search on youtube should should be able to find a large number of documentaries disputing the official version. Start with "In Plane Site"
Cheers
Russell
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jmd
Member
fourhares.com
Posts: 1,081
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Post by jmd on Nov 27, 2007 10:49:55 GMT
Your comment, Bro John Ford, even though unintended, is actually far closer to the mark than Bro Antonius stating that "this is identical to the tower card in tarot, wich stands for disaster and conflict in its basic meaning" - much of tarot has been, unfortunately as far as I'm concerned, mis-represented and altered nearly beyond due recognition by the overlays that the GD and other organisations have overlayed onto it. I'm going to have to digress a little for this... but tarot has been mentioned. The likely basis for the development of the 'Tower' ( Maison Dieu or 'House of God') card as it occurs on most decks (though not the 'Charles VI' from the 15th century) is likely to be from images that take their basis from a pseudo-infancy gospel, in which false idols fall as the infant Jesus enters Egypt. To the 13th and later century mind, the dominant false ideology and religion in Egypt is islamic, and hence possible minarets are depicted as falling. Consider, for example, this 13th c. example from Amiens Cathedral:
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Post by Antonius on Nov 28, 2007 23:44:40 GMT
well im talking about its most basic meaning, the very first impression any1 who does not know tarot would get from the image. the very first thing to be suggested to the subconcious.
what matters here is not artist intent, but what the subconciouss picks up and how that influences the conciouss actions of people. could be the religious aspect plays a major role in this, the whole war was initialy sold as a conflict between the good moral christians and the smelly evil women opressing muslims. though im not up on the tower card enuff to go into that at this time. anyways the first most basic meaning of the tower in any run of the mill divination oriented tarot book is allways conflict and disaster. (and it works) and the people to be affected by the image are random citizens, not specificly tarot users, just like the client of an ignorant diviner working with a cheap new age book. it works on the masses like it works for them.
im not saying that whoever did it neccecerily had to know of tarot. what im saying is that whoever planned the attack was looking for the most dramatic image that would have the most profound effect on the people watching on tv. and that the image they came up with happens to be very similar to the tower card. meaning that they were very succesfull in determining wich image would have the biggest effect. conflict and disaster have been dominant in america's mind, and still is to this very day. hell thats the very thing thats the administation uses to justify just about everything they have done since the event.
anyways i just wanted to point that out to illustrate that a person with superior knowledge of how this stuff works could easily use it against people.
(wich incidently is one of the key concepts fueling the conspiracy geek. people freak out when the realise symbols can effect the mind so deeply, and then see symbols all around them. at that point they are very sensitive to suggestion for what may be behind it)
and that this practice is an integral part of our daily lives and enters our living rooms every time we turn on a tv. because what we call marketing and advertisement is exactly that: a bunch of people using psychology to find ways of manipulating people by using symbols to feed ideas to our subconciouss.
so there are plenty of thoughts that are not our own, and they result in us buying stuff we dont need and things like that.
and these people spend not one second of thought on what kind of side effects such agressive mindjobs might have on a culture. look at the way MTV uses peer pressure to get kids to dress and talk the way they tell them etc etc. look at how confused kids today are.
there is so much of this stuff now that we end up in a situation where all these people are walking around with profound needs for things, wile every scumbag with some airtime tries to convince them it is their product that is going to fill the void, and now were so deep that nobody even knows there the needs come from or what they are supposed to answer them with anymore. so they go into horrible spiraling credit debt to buy that big shiney car only to be bored with it the moment the next big shiney car comes out etc etc.
we are besieged by massive attempts at manipulation from every angle with ever more conflicting signals, and its not healthy...
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Post by maat on Nov 29, 2007 3:54:47 GMT
Antonius
What do people do when they want to replace an old residence and build a brand new one? They have to tear down the old one.
(One might ask what does God do when he wants to replace an old and worn out residence with a brand new one? ;D Can't resist putting forward my 'reincarnation' view of things.)
Sometimes what seem like disasters are blessings in disguise. Check out the Helen Kellar story.
The Death card signifies the end of something and new beginnings The Tower care signifies big changes ... not necessarily with bad outcomes
For example, if you wish to pursue your wish to become a Freemason, you might need to tear down some of what you have built up around yourself, so that the new ediface can be erected. Masons are builders, they try to build beautiful temples within themselves.
Maat
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Post by maat on Nov 29, 2007 4:03:14 GMT
look at how confused kids today are. Maybe parents/teachers/and those that blame others can take a lead from Bill Gates... Love him or hate him, he sure hits the nail on the head with this! To anyone with kids of any age, here's some advice. Bill Gates recently gave a speech at a High School about 11 things they did not and will not learn in school. He talks about how feel- good, politically correct teachings created a generation of kids with no concept of reality and how this concept set them up for failure in the real world. Rule 1: Life is not fair - get used to it! Rule 2: The world won't care about your self-esteem. The world will expect you to accomplish something BEFORE you feel good about yourself. Rule 3: You will NOT make $60,000 a year right out of high school. You won't be a vice-president with a car phone until you earn both. Rule 4: If you think your teacher is tough, wait till you get a boss. Rule 5: Flipping burgers is not beneath your dignity. Your Grandparents had a different word for burger flipping: they called it opportunity. Rule 6: If you mess up, it's not your parents' fault, so don't whine about your mistakes, learn from them. Rule 7: Before you were born, your parents weren't as boring as they are now.. They got that way from paying your bills, cleaning your clothes and listening to you talk about how cool you thought you were. So before you save the rain forest from the parasites of your parent's generation, try delousing the closet in your own room. Rule 8: Your school may have done away with winners and losers, but life HAS NOT. In some schools, they have abolished failing grades and they'll give you as MANY TIMES as you want to get the right answer. This doesn't bear the slightest resemblance to ANYTHING in real life. Rule 9: Life is not divided into semesters. You don't get summers off and very few employers are interested in helping you FIND YOURSELF. Do that on your own time. Rule 10: Television is NOT real life. In real life people actually have to leave the coffee shop and go to jobs. Rule 11: Be nice to nerds. Chances are you'll end up working for one. (My favourite ) Maat Ooh... and I had better add that I don't (work for nerds). Wonderful people, we deserve each other
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Post by wayseer on Nov 29, 2007 6:00:03 GMT
what im saying is that whoever planned the attack was looking for the most dramatic image that would have the most profound effect on the people watching on tv.
Your view of the world is very Westernised. I tend to look at it from the other side of the mirror - that the Twin Towers was more likely a blasphemous image, like the imagery of the Tower of Babel, for (certain) Moslems.
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Post by wayseer on Nov 29, 2007 6:05:32 GMT
Maat - I just love that. The interesting thing is that, give the odd word change here and there, the 'rules' are the very foundation of any counselling session. I would be brazen enought add a 12th rule
- after all that; it's your call.
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Post by hollandr on Nov 30, 2007 2:09:53 GMT
Returning to the subject of the thread:
I wonder if anyone here has been obsessed by a thought that is unwanted but will not go away
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Post by Antonius on Nov 30, 2007 12:38:57 GMT
again: the people to be effected by this event were ignorant westerners completely stuck in materialistic thought patterns each and every one of them. they dont know any of these origins and deep meanings, and they dont have to. its about what effect such an image has on the subconciouss and the most direct immediate association is the most obvious one. THAT is what has the greatest effect on unsuspecting westerners and that is the effect we can see in america every single day from the very day of the event itself to today, and likely well into the nect decennium.
all this religious stuff and original meaning of tarot is not relevant to my point. its about immediate associations.
for pete's sake, how can u look at that, and the way people acted since then and not understand what im trying to say?
Maat, if you are attempting to give me advice, i had those 11 points figured out when i was 12. i was coming up with confusian ideas when i was 8.
how meny times to have to tell you guys im not an idiot?
also none of those 12 points describe me in any way. please reserve your judgement for when u know me a little better, because u seem to be equating me with a very american stereotype that doesnt even seem to exist out here.
i know you mean well, i realy do, but please understand that a well ment prejudice is still a prejudice, and it realy doesnt help.
this thread is about wether or not it is possible to think thoughts that are not your own. im saying its not only possible, it happens all the time, and we have grown to think it is normal.
advertising = millions of companies paying psychologists millions of dollars to come up with the best way to impose thoughts on others that will make you do things they want you to do instead of what you want to do by making us think we were the ones who came up with the idea of buying an item of luxery that you dont need with money u dont have.
and again, with no thought to any possible side effects, such as collumbine and virginia tech.
also THIS is the reason freemasonry doesnt get as meny petitions as it used to.
people have needs, and advertisement does everything in its immense power to make sure you think their product what will fill the void in your life. and so masses of people keep buying masses of stuff and never fill the hole. never even getting a chance to figure out the true cause of the void as we have.
it takes something powerfull to break away from that stuff. you guys have masonry, i have something a little more drastic, but hte bulk of people out there dont have anything.
and you all have seen them, you see them every day. washing their cars they only bought to make sure their phantom penis is bigger then the guy next door etc etc etc.
im not talking about you or me here, im talking about those lifeless drones who judge everything, blaim everyone and never come up with the idea to look in the mirror.
dont you see? most of these people dont even know there is a mirror...
(and dont ever compare me to those people again, you have no idea what that does to me)
honetsly, look at society, look at the mob and tell me this is what was intended...
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Post by hollandr on Nov 30, 2007 21:47:06 GMT
>look at society, look at the mob and tell me this is what was intended... It is clear the human race has more than its share of problems but a major shift in its consciousness has occurred in the last few months. Until now major nations have argued that they should not be first movers on greenhouse gases as it would disadvantage them. Now 150 of the largest companies are demanding legally enforceable reductions. www.csrwire.com/News/10272.htmlThis is a symptom of the human race accepting its responsibilities even while its governments do not Who leads humanity now? "The group of 150 companies behind the communique were coordinated by the Prince of Wales's Corporate Leaders Group on Climate Change." Who says the British monarchy is useless? Cheers Russell
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Post by Antonius on Nov 30, 2007 23:22:33 GMT
ehhh, do you remember those people saying 'wait till the science is in' about global warming? well the science is in, and there is no connection between co2 and global warming. anyways if im making a 'wake up people, dont you see whats going on here' type of impression, lol that was not my intention. its just that this realisation has saved me so much $$$ and dissapointment, i just had to share... anyways, yeah i do see what u mean. and i totaly agree. theres alot going on right now. including this whole conspiracy scene. from it has spawned a thing that calles itself the 'truth movement' and as the name suggests (though their concentrating on 911 makes them look like conspiracy nuts) there all about accountability of authority. so uknow, there all scared and confused, but the seed is there. and there all gonna vote ron paul btw. lol go to a rally with a 'freemasons for ron paul' banner if u want to see some confused faces also how about that ron paul campeign? love him or hate him, its been a long time since any outsider managed to get anywhere at all, and this guy collects 4.3 million bucks in 1 day without even doing anything. score one for the underdog... i think internet is making alot of these things happen. humanity has never communicated on this level before, and communication is everything when it comes to evolution other then biological.
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