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Post by maat on Mar 5, 2008 22:35:36 GMT
Back to Velikovsky and his predictions...
SUN
Proven: Electrically charged. Electromagnetism fundamental to the Universe.
MERCURY
Proven: Electromagnetic field. Unproven: Night side warm.
VENUS
Proven: Anomalous rotation. Hot. Massive atmosphere.
Unproven: Split from Jupiter. Cooling steadily. Hydrocarbons in atmosphere. (re the split, that big swirling 'storm' ?)
EARTH
Proven: Magnetosphere as far as Moon. Changes have occurred in the Earth's rotation. Geomagnetic reversals accompanied extinctions. Some oil deposits recent, and are from space. Gross Bronze Age climatic change. Widespread destructions during Bronze Age (not from human agency).
Unproven: Origin of ocean salt in space. A Universal Deluge. Drastic Bronze Age sea-level change.
MARS
Proven: Localized radioactive spots. Moon like surface. Argon in atmosphere.
Unproven: Micro-organisms pathogenic to Man. Polar caps of frozen carbohydrates.
JUPITER
Proven: Emits radio noises.
SATURN
Proven: Contains water and chlorine.
Unproven: Emits X-Rays.
URANUS
Unproven: Magnetic field.
NEPTUNE
Unproven: Highly charged.
MOON
Proven: Remnant magnetism in rocks. Heat flow from interior. Argon and Neon in rocks. Frequent moon-quakes. Hydrocarbons on surface. Radioactive hot-spots.
Unproven: Surface recently molten. Most craters form from large bubbles.
COMETS & METEORITES
Proven: Some comets have recent origin. Cometary tails contain hydrocarbons. Some meteorites contain argon and neon.
The above info from The World Atlas of Mysteries - Francis Hitching - published by Pan Books in 1978.
Thirty years on in 2008, I would be most interested to hear if any more of the then unproven items have been proven.
Maat
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 6, 2008 10:15:06 GMT
With the profound advances in cosmology, it would be more honest and accurate to say that most of his "unproven" predictions have, along with his general theory, been falsified: Of the "proven" predictions, none seem all that remarkable. Bearing-in-mind that Velikovsky's qualifications were in medicine, psychiatry and psychoanalysis, he would have had to acquaint himself with some cosmological possibilities to add credibility to his tendentious account.
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 6, 2008 16:18:48 GMT
See you and me are very much alike Tamrin. Not so: I address a person's ideas / Sooner or later, you address the person and pretend you are just having a bit of fun (albeit, once targeted, the target is entitled to respond in kind).
(Maat... maat... are you alright? She has melted away folks.)
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Post by hollandr on Mar 6, 2008 22:41:12 GMT
>I address a person's ideas
>I do not give equal credence to those advocated by tin-foil hat types, nor indeed to the delusions of those who experience more extreme psychoses.
Sometimes it is difficult to know which way to go
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Post by maat on Mar 6, 2008 23:40:52 GMT
See you and me are very much alike Tamrin. Not so: I address a person's ideas / Sooner or later, you address the person and pretend you are just having a bit of fun (albeit, once targeted, the target is entitled to respond in kind).
(Maat... maat... are you alright? She has melted away folks.) T'was just the nearness of you..... Maat
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Post by maat on Mar 6, 2008 23:44:55 GMT
With the profound advances in cosmology, it would be more honest and accurate to say that most of his "unproven" predictions have, along with his general theory, been falsified Maat I may be blonde but I do know what falsified means. I also know what makes people extremely pedantic.
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Post by maximus on Mar 7, 2008 6:37:33 GMT
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 7, 2008 7:04:32 GMT
I also know what makes people extremely pedantic. What? The desire for intellectual honesty?
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 7, 2008 7:12:31 GMT
>I address a person's ideas
>I do not give equal credence to those advocated by tin-foil hat types, nor indeed to the delusions of those who experience more extreme psychoses.
Sometimes it is difficult to know which way to go Perhaps for some: Which individuals do you think I was addressing? Do you identify with that description? Please bear-in-mind that for several years I worked in the field of Mental Health and have dealt with some desperately dysfunctional people.
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Post by billmcelligott on Mar 7, 2008 14:00:11 GMT
Well spotted Philip, the idiots got it on back to front.
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Post by hollandr on Mar 7, 2008 21:57:06 GMT
>Which individuals do you think I was addressing?
Is this an ad hominem question?
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 7, 2008 22:06:27 GMT
>Which individuals do you think I was addressing?
Is this an ad hominem question? It was not my intention but, from your having raised the issue, perhaps you see it that way.
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 8, 2008 5:09:51 GMT
Again your rationality leaves me defeated From the number of times you have said as much and still persisted, I see you more as a Black Knight ;D
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 9, 2008 3:24:04 GMT
I may be blonde but I do know what falsified means. My apologies, I provided the link in case you (or others) were unfamiliar with Popper's falsifiable criterion for scientific propositions. After all, you had said: For the record I left school when I was 15, girls did that in those days. I have not had the opportunity to learn about the rules for debate, etc. And a lot of the time I have no idea what you are talking about. Blonde, (but very beautiful) & short attention span?
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Post by maat on Mar 10, 2008 23:01:32 GMT
I also know what makes people extremely pedantic. What? The desire for intellectual honesty? Fear!
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Post by hollandr on Mar 11, 2008 2:34:14 GMT
Stunned silence!
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 11, 2008 6:45:14 GMT
I also know what makes people extremely pedantic. What? The desire for intellectual honesty? Fear!Then, in this context and from my perspective, your non sequitur is both mistaken and offensive.
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Post by maat on Mar 11, 2008 22:13:16 GMT
Then, in this context and from my perspective, your non sequitur is both mistaken and offensive. You are probably right - I did wrestle with myself before and after making my post - which I believe is true. People who fear the big picture concentrate on the minutiae. People who fear the 'big idea' will focus on the words used to expound them. People who fear that their 'position' in life is being challenged will try to ridicule those who 'they think' is their opponent. If you are a fearful person, I had no right to bring that to the notice of others. If this is the situation as you see it then I apologise unreservedly. However, there is another side to this coin, I took the position that you were verbally bullying me and as I have stated before, and consistently, on this forum - the world has no need for bullies and the one way to correct a bullying situation is to stand up to them, look them square in the eye, and say 'enough!' Your call. Maat
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 12, 2008 6:50:56 GMT
People who fear the big picture concentrate on the minutiae. People who fear the 'big idea' will focus on the words used to expound them. People who fear that their 'position' in life is being challenged will try to ridicule those who 'they think' is their opponent. Your having raised the matter, I suggest a doubtful analysis of this kind might be better applied to yourself, being fearful of or, for whatever reason, wishing to distance yourself from "reality." Albeit, in your case, this appears to involve the avoidance of the "minutiae" of inconvenient truths (the "devil" really is in the detail). If you are a fearful person, I had no right to bring that to the notice of others. If this is the situation as you see it then I apologise unreservedly. I will not even bother defending myself against your grubby insult, beyond stating that I believe my actions on various fronts have been self-evidently NOT fearful. The point is, whether or not I happen to be a fearful person, your action in publishing that slur was unmasonic and libelous. As for your "apology," your following paragraph clearly demonstrates the reservations and lack of sincerity with which it was expressed. However, there is another side to this coin, I took the position that you were verbally bullying me and as I have stated before, and consistently, on this forum - the world has no need for bullies and the one way to correct a bullying situation is to stand up to them, look them square in the eye, and say 'enough!' Please show where I have verbally bullied YOU—Where one is struggling in a debate it is usually because one is wrong ( truth will out), not because the other is a bully—As previously stated, it has been YOU who, for want of a credible response, sooner or later turns from the issue at hand and, as in this instance, makes matters personal, often pretending to be just having a bit of fun. I am not amused and I too say, 'enough!'
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Post by maat on Mar 12, 2008 21:17:12 GMT
Good - we agree. Easy. Maat
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