Post by hollandr on Apr 19, 2008 3:17:27 GMT
I was reminded of this by Philip's link that said "Two kinds of habitat are known to give rise to naked mammals - a subterranean one or a wet one." The site explored the wet hypothesis but not the subterranean possibility
For some decades I assumed that the underworld was a reference to an astral hell.
Then I wondered how the underworld could be astral (starry) which by definition must be above so I looked a little further
While it is pretty much unquestioned these days that the underworld is not a physical place, there were of course many books about an underworld in the late 19th century of which Journey to the Centre of the Earth is the most famous.
And there is a general tendency in academic circles to label as symbolic any accounts that are not within the general experience of modern academics.
So I had a quick look at some of the docs I have accumulated on my hard drive to see what might be interesting
One thing I found was: "Mabon, the “Great Son” and God of Light of Celtic mythology, the young god who was imprisoned in the Underworld - the realm of Death of the Celts. Known as Mabon ap Modron, which translates as the “Son of the Great Mother”"
This seems to have distinct Masonic connections in the name Mabon and in being a "Son of the ..." Also see the reference to the Lord of Light/Life in the 3rd degree ritual
And there might be another connection:
"Dr Alfred Jeremias, in his The Babylonian Conception of Heaven and London, 1902), notes that the Mistress of the Underworld ..............was a Lion Headed Goddess. "
I suppose a lion headed goddess might have a lion's grip
In the egyptian tradition the underworld was Amenta
"Amenta, or Amenti, translates into “The Hidden Land”, and is referred to by E.A. Budge as an underworld location in ancient Egyptian cosmology - a place where “a judgment of the dead took place”. Later on Amenta was equated with the Greek Hades or Hell by the Coptics."
And in the nordic tradition:
"The two halls Valhalla and Hel, are those which seem to replicate the christian Heaven and Hell most closely-indeed, the christian place of punishment draws its name ..... from the name of the Germanic underworld: Hell, the “place of concealment”."
So both the Egyptians and the Norse thought the underworld was hidden or concealed. I was always taught that Hell is easy to find.
More Egyptian:
"Others believe it was an Underworld, and indeed much of its scenes were of a subterranean world of tunnels and caverns with unseen gods, pools of boiling waters, eerie lights, chambers guarded by birds, doors that open by themselves. ..... The Duat was further perplexing, because in spite of its terrestrial nature (it was reached after crossing through a mountain pass) or subterranean aspects, its name was written hieroglyphically with a star and a soaring falcon ................. denoting a celestial or heavenly association."
And here is the Maori version that links the subterranean underworld with the stars
"According to the Maori seers......... Raro, lord of the subterranean underworld married Raumati, another goddess, and produced three children. They were Puanga (Rigel), Takurua (Sirius), and Matariki (the Pleiades), all of whom promptly left their dark home and mounted the heavens. There they have remained, keeping the fires that they obtained in the Earth's core forever burning in the sky."
So the underworld is a place where gods can be born before ascending to the heavens
And in 1945 a story about beings living in the earth (Teros and Deros) published in Amazing Stories produced a storm of letters claiming the story was true. "The issue sold out, and generated quite a response: between 1945 and 1949, letters poured in attesting to the truth of Shaver's claims (tens of thousands of letters, according to Palmer). The correspondents, too, had heard strange voices or encountered denizens of the hollow Earth."
So what are we to make of this?
Does the Earth contain civilisations within?
Is it important?
Well here is an account from an initiate of the Isaic Mysteries (of the widow Isis)
"Understand that I approached the bounds of death, I trod the threshold of Proserpine, and after that I was ravished through all the elements, I returned to my proper place; about midnight I saw the sun brightly shine; I saw likewise the gods celestial and the gods infernal, before whom I presented myself and worshiped them."
Note that the initiate saw the sun at midnight - a situation referred to in Masonry where it is veiled by a reference to Masonry being spread across the world - an assertion more valid for fishing and TV.
Perhaps in primitive Masonry the candidate did see the "gods infernal" who were in the underworld (the threshold of Proserpine)
These days Masonry re-enacts aspects of the ancient practices.
Perhaps we might do better in future
Cheers
Russell
For some decades I assumed that the underworld was a reference to an astral hell.
Then I wondered how the underworld could be astral (starry) which by definition must be above so I looked a little further
While it is pretty much unquestioned these days that the underworld is not a physical place, there were of course many books about an underworld in the late 19th century of which Journey to the Centre of the Earth is the most famous.
And there is a general tendency in academic circles to label as symbolic any accounts that are not within the general experience of modern academics.
So I had a quick look at some of the docs I have accumulated on my hard drive to see what might be interesting
One thing I found was: "Mabon, the “Great Son” and God of Light of Celtic mythology, the young god who was imprisoned in the Underworld - the realm of Death of the Celts. Known as Mabon ap Modron, which translates as the “Son of the Great Mother”"
This seems to have distinct Masonic connections in the name Mabon and in being a "Son of the ..." Also see the reference to the Lord of Light/Life in the 3rd degree ritual
And there might be another connection:
"Dr Alfred Jeremias, in his The Babylonian Conception of Heaven and London, 1902), notes that the Mistress of the Underworld ..............was a Lion Headed Goddess. "
I suppose a lion headed goddess might have a lion's grip
In the egyptian tradition the underworld was Amenta
"Amenta, or Amenti, translates into “The Hidden Land”, and is referred to by E.A. Budge as an underworld location in ancient Egyptian cosmology - a place where “a judgment of the dead took place”. Later on Amenta was equated with the Greek Hades or Hell by the Coptics."
And in the nordic tradition:
"The two halls Valhalla and Hel, are those which seem to replicate the christian Heaven and Hell most closely-indeed, the christian place of punishment draws its name ..... from the name of the Germanic underworld: Hell, the “place of concealment”."
So both the Egyptians and the Norse thought the underworld was hidden or concealed. I was always taught that Hell is easy to find.
More Egyptian:
"Others believe it was an Underworld, and indeed much of its scenes were of a subterranean world of tunnels and caverns with unseen gods, pools of boiling waters, eerie lights, chambers guarded by birds, doors that open by themselves. ..... The Duat was further perplexing, because in spite of its terrestrial nature (it was reached after crossing through a mountain pass) or subterranean aspects, its name was written hieroglyphically with a star and a soaring falcon ................. denoting a celestial or heavenly association."
And here is the Maori version that links the subterranean underworld with the stars
"According to the Maori seers......... Raro, lord of the subterranean underworld married Raumati, another goddess, and produced three children. They were Puanga (Rigel), Takurua (Sirius), and Matariki (the Pleiades), all of whom promptly left their dark home and mounted the heavens. There they have remained, keeping the fires that they obtained in the Earth's core forever burning in the sky."
So the underworld is a place where gods can be born before ascending to the heavens
And in 1945 a story about beings living in the earth (Teros and Deros) published in Amazing Stories produced a storm of letters claiming the story was true. "The issue sold out, and generated quite a response: between 1945 and 1949, letters poured in attesting to the truth of Shaver's claims (tens of thousands of letters, according to Palmer). The correspondents, too, had heard strange voices or encountered denizens of the hollow Earth."
So what are we to make of this?
Does the Earth contain civilisations within?
Is it important?
Well here is an account from an initiate of the Isaic Mysteries (of the widow Isis)
"Understand that I approached the bounds of death, I trod the threshold of Proserpine, and after that I was ravished through all the elements, I returned to my proper place; about midnight I saw the sun brightly shine; I saw likewise the gods celestial and the gods infernal, before whom I presented myself and worshiped them."
Note that the initiate saw the sun at midnight - a situation referred to in Masonry where it is veiled by a reference to Masonry being spread across the world - an assertion more valid for fishing and TV.
Perhaps in primitive Masonry the candidate did see the "gods infernal" who were in the underworld (the threshold of Proserpine)
These days Masonry re-enacts aspects of the ancient practices.
Perhaps we might do better in future
Cheers
Russell