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Post by nventr on Jan 26, 2011 21:02:53 GMT
The thing to understand about light and darkness from a Masonic perspective is that we do not speak of the things themselves but in entirely symbolical terms. It may seem to you that this is insultingly obvious, but from experience I find it's always worth pointing out the insultingly obvious, because it's often the thing that no-one has actually considered. In that Masonic symbolic system, light means knowledge, and darkness ignorance. Whereas in much common Christian symbolism, light means the power of good (and of God), while darkness signifies evil as a positive (i.e., a real, directed) force. A lot of the stinking nonsense of which Freemasons are accused by so-called Christians is entirely to do with just that level of misunderstanding. Similarly, when light is accorded masculine status, and darkness is identified with everything female and hence negative, it must be understood that this relates to an old-fashioned Classical model of binary opposites, where every quality was paired with its complement in an unconsciously sexist, racist and supremacist manner. These correspondences are not absolute, they were drawn up by Man (and usually by men, into the bargain) and it is up to us to re-formulate correspondences to suit our altered mindset and worldview. Opposites, where we tolerate them to exist, may pair up according to any scheme that suits our cultural outlook; for there is nothing objective or self-evident in the conceptual reality of the intellect. The path will begin where you are. Those who are feminine or anima-based will begin in the dark. Those who are masculine or animus-based will begin in the light. The object of the path is to internalize and balance both.
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Post by sid on Jan 26, 2011 22:18:34 GMT
Greetings, The thing to understand about light and darkness from a Masonic perspective is that we do not speak of the things themselves but in entirely symbolical terms. It may seem to you that this is insultingly obvious, but from experience I find it's always worth pointing out the insultingly obvious, because it's often the thing that no-one has actually considered. In that Masonic symbolic system, light means knowledge, and darkness ignorance. Whereas in much common Christian symbolism, light means the power of good (and of God), while darkness signifies evil as a positive (i.e., a real, directed) force. A lot of the stinking nonsense of which Freemasons are accused by so-called Christians is entirely to do with just that level of misunderstanding. Similarly, when light is accorded masculine status, and darkness is identified with everything female and hence negative, it must be understood that this relates to an old-fashioned Classical model of binary opposites, where every quality was paired with its complement in an unconsciously sexist, racist and supremacist manner. These correspondences are not absolute, they were drawn up by Man (and usually by men, into the bargain) and it is up to us to re-formulate correspondences to suit our altered mindset and worldview. Opposites, where we tolerate them to exist, may pair up according to any scheme that suits our cultural outlook; for there is nothing objective or self-evident in the conceptual reality of the intellect. The path will begin where you are. Those who are feminine or anima-based will begin in the dark. Those who are masculine or animus-based will begin in the light. The object of the path is to internalize and balance both. I am sure that there are many ways one can view and discuss this subject. There are 4 points of entry and the centre is everywhere. The Agens and Patens when united form a cross. Open the stone and enter within.
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Post by nventr on Jan 27, 2011 2:57:32 GMT
I agree that the four pillars are the wheels of the divine chariot. The horizon completes the cross of the Tree of Life. But the heart of the matter is quite a kettle of fish. No one should have to take it through the nose.
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Post by sid on Jan 27, 2011 11:22:44 GMT
I agree that the four pillars are the wheels of the divine chariot. The horizon completes the cross of the Tree of Life. But the heart of the matter is quite a kettle of fish. No one should have to take it through the nose. Not sure I understand what you mean by 'No one should have to take it through the nose.' (??)
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Post by irishmason on Jan 27, 2011 15:21:00 GMT
If there would be no light , there would be no darkness, and if their would be no darkness there would be no light.
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Post by nventr on Jan 27, 2011 16:42:57 GMT
I agree that the four pillars are the wheels of the divine chariot. The horizon completes the cross of the Tree of Life. But the heart of the matter is quite a kettle of fish. No one should have to take it through the nose. Not sure I understand what you mean by 'No one should have to take it through the nose.' (??) The Christian fish symbol when placed vertically is another depiction of the inner sanctum. The "tail" is actually an arrow that points the direction of entry into the inner sanctum. Attachments:
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Post by maximus on Jan 27, 2011 17:18:40 GMT
The "Christian" fish symbol is a representation of the divine feminine, hidden in plain sight.
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Post by nventr on Jan 27, 2011 18:39:34 GMT
The "Christian" fish symbol is a representation of the divine feminine, hidden in plain sight. This is true of the Gold fish. It is the representation of the Way of Passion, the Holy Spear, and the tomb. The silver fish is the representation of the Divine Masculine, hidden in plain sight. It is a representation of the Way of Grace, The Holy Grail, and the womb.
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Post by sid on Jan 27, 2011 23:20:10 GMT
The "Christian" fish symbol is a representation of the divine feminine, hidden in plain sight. This is true of the Gold fish. It is the representation of the Way of Passion, the Holy Spear, and the tomb. The silver fish is the representation of the Divine Masculine, hidden in plain sight. It is a representation of the Way of Grace, The Holy Grail, and the womb. In a 4 1/2 hour guided tour of Rosslyn Chapel we were shown another symbol. The old man who gave us the tour was both a stone mason & a Freemason
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Post by maat on Mar 6, 2011 23:07:30 GMT
Aaaaaaaaaaaagh, then you have to explain, how come at one point there was nothing, then there was something. Imagine stuff getting sucked into a black hole and then exploded out the other side with a big bang. Science has already established that particles pop in and out of view (our view) in a seeming random way. They now are coming to the realisation that there may well be mini black holes floating around everywhere. Doors to other dimensions. There are currently conducting experiments trying to prove their existance. It would seem to me that a perfect balance of Darkness and Light are need to our very existance here. 'Evi'l has shown itself to be a major factor in the evolution of consciousness and other qualities over vast periods of time. Maybe when we ascend to the point that we now longer need the lessons of Darkness, we disappear into the next stage of exisitance. Energy runs the body, so when the body dies (or perfected?) The operating energy it is 'displaced', moves on.
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Post by billmcelligott on Mar 7, 2011 0:17:33 GMT
OK , I imagine there is stuff and I imagine there is a black hole.
But where did the stuff come from and where did the black hole come from.
Whichever way and from whatever angle you approach this conundrum, there has to at some point be an appearance of stuff, where there was at first nothing. Within the compass of science as we know it there is no explanation.
There is no atom, oh wait a sec an atom has just appeared ? Like the Rabbit out of the Magicians Hat , something magical has to happen or there is an explanation.
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Post by maat on Mar 7, 2011 1:45:44 GMT
Have you ever tried to imagine 'nothing'?
Try thinking of 'nothing' and then condensing it.
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Tamrin
Member
Nosce te ipsum
Posts: 3,586
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 7, 2011 2:47:59 GMT
OK , I imagine there is stuff and I imagine there is a black hole. But where did the stuff come from and where did the black hole come from. Whichever way and from whatever angle you approach this conundrum, there has to at some point be an appearance of stuff, where there was at first nothing. Within the compass of science as we know it there is no explanation. There is no atom, oh wait a sec an atom has just appeared ? Like the Rabbit out of the Magicians Hat , something magical has to happen or there is an explanation. Such logic involves an infinite regression: If one says a creator (or, in this case, a magician) is required to explain existence, what created the magician... and so ad infinitum?
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Post by whistler on Mar 7, 2011 7:41:42 GMT
Have you ever tried to imagine 'nothing'? Try thinking of 'nothing' and then condensing it. Kia Ora Maat Welcome Back Try thinking of nothing mmm "nothing" is something - so does one try thinking of the word of nothing - then should nothing be a void - I think trying to think if nothing leaves me a little confused- if I erase all my thoughts in order to think of a state of nothingness- something that is not nothing appears
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Post by middlepillar on Mar 7, 2011 9:02:07 GMT
This brings back a memory of mine as a 17 year old! I went on holiday with 3 friends to The Norfolk Broads, on the train journey back we spent the entire journey back discussing nothing! My opinion (which hs not changed!) is simply that there is no such thing as nothing, nothing is something. Thanks for the memory! Have you ever tried to imagine 'nothing'? Try thinking of 'nothing' and then condensing it. Kia Ora Maat Welcome Back Try thinking of nothing mmm "nothing" is something - so does one try thinking of the word of nothing - then should nothing be a void - I think trying to think if nothing leaves me a little confused- if I erase all my thoughts in order to think of a state of nothingness- something that is not nothing appears
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Post by maat on Mar 7, 2011 22:35:29 GMT
if I erase all my thoughts in order to think of a state of nothingness- something that is not nothing appears Whistler, your mind is a condenser
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Post by sammy on Mar 8, 2011 15:41:01 GMT
Very interesting concepts guys. It brought up a new aspect I hadnt considered. If light is "active energy" and shadow is the consequence of light on a body. That would mean the light God gave us is projecting out but striking a body before reaching the end, creating a shadow. If everyone has found there own light, what shadow could exist? Perhaps just changes of shades in color of light?
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Post by rembrandt on Mar 8, 2011 17:43:24 GMT
A very wise man, a priest in the Orthodox tradition, taught me that "God did not create death." Another teacher of mine told me that "hell is just the absence of God." Hard thinking.
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Post by nventr on Nov 29, 2011 18:08:28 GMT
The paths of the fish towers move in opposite directions.
The intellectual or animus-based path begins in the light and ends in the darkness of the womb. It moves from the base chakra to the top chakra. Soear first then the Grail.
The creative or anima-based path begins in the darkness and ends in the light of understanding. It moves from the top chakra to the base chakra. Cup first then the Spear.
A person must complete both paths to be fully psychologically integrated.
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