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Post by nventr on Mar 23, 2011 16:07:23 GMT
I began my studies in comparative religion and psychology because of apparent similarities. It was interesting. There are aspects of any culture that are most likely the result of Jungian archetypes (evolved psychological mechanisms) but their manifestations and applications can be radically different. It isn't a leap to state that all (the vast vast majority) or religions have a creation myth. They are all talking about the creation of the world if not the whole universe. Within in that myth the differences can be striking. The similarity of religious myths does not constitute evidence that the various cultures are talking about the same thing. In some cases it is absolutely clear. Many religions don't have a "chosen people," some don't have "hell." One of the foremost reasons that it would be pre-mature to say that the religions are talking about the same thing is the adage that the simpliest solution is most likely correct. I refer again to Jung's archetypes and the follow up work by Stevens. The emergent quality of archetypes would explain more about the similarities amongst religions than any proposed world connection or hypothetical supernatural force. I too have studied Jung, but have found that while he proposes that the psyche has both an animus and anima, he stops short of the development of the anima. He follows the traditional alchemist path for the development of the animus and black balls the "The Secret of the Golden Flower" which is the traditional developmental path of the anima-based personality. Jung is right that an animus-based personality should not walk this path until they have fully completed the path of alchemy. However, "The Secret of the Golden Flower" is the search for the Holy Grail, for those who have been knighted. "The Secret of the Golden Flower" is also the Virgin Path or the developmental path of those who are creative or anima-based personalities. What I have found amazing is that these two paths are mirror images of each other. The alchemy path has "the chosen people" and the virgin path sees all people as unique individual pieces in the larger puzzle of life. (This is why no woman wants to attend a party in the same dress as another woman) The alchemy path requires a master or group to serve as guides. In the virgin path, Heart, Spirit or God guides. The list goes on and on. The key to personal development is following the path that matches your psyche. Most cultures instituted these paths by physical body shape. We cannot do that any more because our educational system forces women to think like men. Then you get all these creative intellectuals (I call them free radicals) that do not follow the universal laws and structure of spirit. Like any building which falls apart when it is not constructed using the proper tools of alignment, so do their conclusions and arguments when they are not grounded in the reality of spiritual law.
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Post by maat on Mar 23, 2011 23:49:15 GMT
The alchemy path requires a master or group to serve as guides. In the virgin path, Heart, Spirit or God guides. The list goes on and on. Hence the beauty of Freemasonry... we need a master group (Principle Officers) to guide us to that centre from which we cannot err. the Second. But we are told that Freemasonry is a progressive science... I would add that the psyche we have in this life might differ from the tools we are issued with in previous or future lives, hence the symbolism one finds in the R.Arch. The Twelve Tribes or the Twelve Signs. We progress and experience life in every type of personality, psyche, sex, etc till we master it entirely.
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Post by nventr on Mar 24, 2011 15:00:28 GMT
The alchemy path requires a master or group to serve as guides. In the virgin path, Heart, Spirit or God guides. The list goes on and on. Hence the beauty of Freemasonry... we need a master group (Principle Officers) to guide us to that centre from which we cannot err. the Second. But we are told that Freemasonry is a progressive science... I would add that the psyche we have in this life might differ from the tools we are issued with in previous or future lives, hence the symbolism one finds in the R.Arch. The Twelve Tribes or the Twelve Signs. We progress and experience life in every type of personality, psyche, sex, etc till we master it entirely. The idea of spiritual progression through one lifetime or many lifetimes is also expressed in the zodiac. Each sign builds upon the one before it. The last four signs are the 4 pillars described by Ezekiel as looking alike but moving in different directions. Each are a complicated amalgamation of both animus and anima. I'm a Sagittarius. To me this sign encompasses the emotional side with the horse body. The horse has been a symbol of the emotions that have a tendency to run free, bolt, or panic. While the head of the man is the logic that sits above the emotions. It is important for the logic to take charge over the emotions or creativity and provide a focus, not let them run willy nilly. It is a masculine sign that must take charge of the feminine/creative/emotional side. Capricorn is a feminine sign that climbs up the mountain. This is exactly the opposite of the natural spiritual development of the anima or creative-based personality. Anima-based personalities develop from the crown down. Yet, it is the way of the "Divine Feminine." This can also be considered the path of testimony for those who have until now had no voice. Aquarius is a masculine sign that depicts a young woman or virgin pouring out water. Water or Grace being the "Divine Masculine." This can also be the "Search for the Grail" for those who have fully completed the Apprentice path. Pisces, is of course, where the road runs both ways. They have experienced both paths. This is the sign of a fully enlightened master who understand both paths and can teach either animus or anima based personalities. While I do not have experience of Freemasonry's specific teachings like the R Arch or Twelve tribes or have the understanding given to those who study these things, these symbols are openly available through other channels like the zodiac and the tarot. Not to mention they are all experiential phenomenon, so those who have never studied such things can decode them without ever picking up a book. The Virgin path and the Apprentice path are mirror images of each other. What is the final attainment for one is the first or beginning step upon the spiritual road for the other. This is why the Bible requires that animus and anima types cleave to each other. Hopefully they will teach each other as they go through life and eventually meet in the middle; Coming to the understanding that both Paths are good and beneficial to this world. This is why the same name cannot mean the exact same thing, even when it is incorporated within the same sign or spiritual level. Each of these signs have to have situation specific interpretations. The Search for the Grail (an advanced path) for a man is the basic Virgin path for a woman. While the development of voice, "I', or ego toward service of global humanity is an advanced path for women, yet the basic path for men. (we women are givers and service oriented but are mostly concerned with the small circle of our families and communities)
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Mr_Chaos
Member
We are legion. We do not forgive. We do not forget.
Posts: 29
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Post by Mr_Chaos on Jun 2, 2011 4:17:51 GMT
Unless this is all a dream and we really don't exist. Please do not discount the Matrix theory. I am a firm believer.
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Post by maat on Jun 6, 2011 1:25:14 GMT
> do not discount the Matrix theory
Check out the pavement...
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Post by anubis on Jun 6, 2011 1:41:21 GMT
The Matrix was a movie...
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Post by billmcelligott on Jun 6, 2011 10:57:23 GMT
The wisest of all men , is the one who says 'I do not know'. - Bill McElligott 2011.
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Post by anubis on Jun 6, 2011 22:33:47 GMT
The unwise man is awake all night worries over and again. When morning rises he is restless still, his burden as before.
- The Havamal
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Post by maat on Jun 7, 2011 1:00:14 GMT
The Matrix was a movie... I know! Maybe I should have posted "check out the pavement... ;D"
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Post by maat on Jun 7, 2011 1:06:44 GMT
Entanglement theory related to the Matrix theory?
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Post by anubis on Jun 7, 2011 1:29:12 GMT
The Matrix was a movie... I know! Maybe I should have posted "check out the pavement... ;D" It does have an esoteric underpinning though. That life is an illusion that we need to free ourselves from. I think this is a false dichotomy.
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Post by maat on Jun 8, 2011 23:57:57 GMT
What do you mean?
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Post by vajranagini on Jun 9, 2011 4:51:31 GMT
There can only be one creation story - so creation happened What ever religion we happen to put our trust in - doesn't alter that original fact - creation still happened. So if we be a Christian, Bhuddist, Hindu, Pagan or coke bottle worshiper. we were created regardless Actually, having religion is of the utmost importance at this time...I have spoken here, before, I believe, of the Kali Yuga, or "Iron Age", the final Aeon in the Hindu doctrine of the kalpas, in which we are now living.... It is said that the sole redeeming value of this Aeon , is that complete and total spiritual accomplishment is possible in one's own lifetime. This Aeon is also when the Demonic element of existence"is in the ascendent" and people "hate Dharma" (i.e. "righteousness") and God, and love falsehood (which is , after all, the essential difference between "the demonic" and "the angelic")and revel in their bodily appetites, to the detriment of the soul. This surely describes what one sees going on around us. This is the reality that is contrived for us every day. But I digress. The great Sufi adept Shri Ramakrishna said that within a hundred years he would "return to collect his devotees, and after that "there would not be liberation for a very long time" This precisely describes the nature of the Aeon of Truth, i.e Sat Yuga, which follows hard upon the heels of the end of the Kali Yuga, known as "Ghora Yuga", or the "Fearsome Aeon", the time of purification at the close of the Kali Yuga...but I again digress. Sat Yugas are VERY long periods of time; they are akin to"Ages" (as in "the Miocene Age") Thus when Ramakrishna says "no liberation for a very long time" he really, really means it. Because spiritual progress moves very slowly indeed during Sat and the other two Yugas that follow it (Dvapara and Treta). In fact it is the decline of righteousness that distinguishes these particular Yugas from each other. So it would make sense that if one has the option to speed up spiritual progress, and prevent being "left behind", that one should avail oneself of the current opportunity... This I believe to be the message behind the Sufis, who know that the Black Aeon is drawing to a close next year, hence the idea of "Building a boat to cross over the Ocean" that Idries Shah spoke of in his book "The Sufis". Thus it is absolutely crucial to have a regular spiritual practice. What it is does not matter, only that you follow its doctrines with faith in one's heart that it will lead you to God. But there is not much time left.
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Post by vajranagini on Jun 9, 2011 4:55:27 GMT
Unless this is all a dream and we really don't exist. Please do not discount the Matrix theory. I am a firm believer. Did you know that the mantra chanted in the "Matrix Theme" is from the Hindu Upanishads (the Brihat Aranyaka Upanishad, to be exact) ? It translates roughly: "Lead us from Untruth to Truth, from Darkness to Light, from Death to Immortality...
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Post by goatrider on Jun 9, 2011 13:41:43 GMT
But there is not much time left. For what?
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Post by vajranagini on Jun 10, 2011 2:46:51 GMT
To avail yourself of the sole benefit of the Kali Yuga: to attain communion with the inner Divine, i.e. "the Knowledge of and Conversation of the Holy Guardian Angel", as Crowley called it..
If you do not undertake the necessary practices to accomplish this task, and thereby attain "liberation" i.e. freedom from the necessity to repeatedly incarnate in a physical body, you will be waiting a loooong loooong time before another opportunity to do so is available to you, as in "thousands, possibly MILLIONS of years". That is, if one's "soul" lasts that long...
The thing about this, is that if I, and by extension, the illuminates who are stressing the need for spiritual attainment are WRONG, then no harm done. If , on the other hand, we are RIGHT about this, then all those who fail to seize the present opportunity will very soon find out to their (nearly) eternal sorrow that their neglect has, quite literally, cost them their "immortal soul". The Kali Yuga is moving towards its end, therefore time is, quite literally "running out".
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Post by vajranagini on Jun 10, 2011 3:17:06 GMT
I began my studies in comparative religion and psychology because of apparent similarities. It was interesting. There are aspects of any culture that are most likely the result of Jungian archetypes (evolved psychological mechanisms) but their manifestations and applications can be radically different. It isn't a leap to state that all (the vast vast majority) or religions have a creation myth. They are all talking about the creation of the world if not the whole universe. Within in that myth the differences can be striking. The similarity of religious myths does not constitute evidence that the various cultures are talking about the same thing. In some cases it is absolutely clear. Many religions don't have a "chosen people," some don't have "hell." One of the foremost reasons that it would be pre-mature to say that the religions are talking about the same thing is the adage that the simpliest solution is most likely correct. I refer again to Jung's archetypes and the follow up work by Stevens. The emergent quality of archetypes would explain more about the similarities amongst religions than any proposed world connection or hypothetical supernatural force. I too have studied Jung, but have found that while he proposes that the psyche has both an animus and anima, he stops short of the development of the anima. He follows the traditional alchemist path for the development of the animus and black balls the "The Secret of the Golden Flower" which is the traditional developmental path of the anima-based personality. Jung is right that an animus-based personality should not walk this path until they have fully completed the path of alchemy. However, "The Secret of the Golden Flower" is the search for the Holy Grail, for those who have been knighted. "The Secret of the Golden Flower" is also the Virgin Path or the developmental path of those who are creative or anima-based personalities. What I have found amazing is that these two paths are mirror images of each other. The alchemy path has "the chosen people" and the virgin path sees all people as unique individual pieces in the larger puzzle of life. (This is why no woman wants to attend a party in the same dress as another woman) The alchemy path requires a master or group to serve as guides. In the virgin path, Heart, Spirit or God guides. The list goes on and on. The key to personal development is following the path that matches your psyche. Most cultures instituted these paths by physical body shape. We cannot do that any more because our educational system forces women to think like men. Then you get all these creative intellectuals (I call them free radicals) that do not follow the universal laws and structure of spirit. Like any building which falls apart when it is not constructed using the proper tools of alignment, so do their conclusions and arguments when they are not grounded in the reality of spiritual law. I am pleasantly surprised to read your post, Nventr, and see that you too have encountered the same spiritual current of the Virgin...this is something I have been pursuing for many years now... It all started in 1994 with a Kundalini awakening; it was after that that the Black Virgin made Herself known to me, and in 2000, after much inner work, I took a quantum leap forward, and She said to me , while directing my attention to the Square and Compass: "You will find Me under this symbol"...and I DID. There is no question, in my mind at least, that the Knights Templar are connected with the cult of the Black Virgin, who represents Truth... and what is Freemasonry, but a cabal of TRUTH-seekers... It is a remarkable experience to be able to consciously interact with the archetypes as they appear in one's life in the guise of the people one meets, and the events that take place. Of course it does require that one be conversant with symbolism, because that is the language with which they communicate, and by which they can be identified.
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Post by goatrider on Jun 10, 2011 13:08:13 GMT
To avail yourself of the sole benefit of the Kali Yuga: to attain communion with the inner Divine, i.e. "the Knowledge of and Conversation of the Holy Guardian Angel", as Crowley called it.. If you do not undertake the necessary practices to accomplish this task, and thereby attain "liberation" i.e. freedom from the necessity to repeatedly incarnate in a physical body, you will be waiting a loooong loooong time before another opportunity to do so is available to you, as in "thousands, possibly MILLIONS of years". That is, if one's "soul" lasts that long... The thing about this, is that if I, and by extension, the illuminates who are stressing the need for spiritual attainment are WRONG, then no harm done. If , on the other hand, we are RIGHT about this, then all those who fail to seize the present opportunity will very soon find out to their (nearly) eternal sorrow that their neglect has, quite literally, cost them their "immortal soul". The Kali Yuga is moving towards its end, therefore time is, quite literally "running out". Doesn't the Lord of Life express Its fulfillment in us by living NOW, rather than in some distant reincarnation? Your post seems driven by fear. Good grief, the rapture came and went a few weeks ago. I tried to convince my fundamentalist friends to give me all their stuff, but they didn't. (I don't think they really believe in it, either.) Are you warning the rest of us that we need to change? I can only hoe my own field, and pull out the weeds so that flowers can grow. But just in case, I have an Ascension Robe (which I'll be wearing along with my new African fez so they can see me). If it looks like it's going to come soon I'll climb on that big boulder next to my garden and wait for the end.
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Post by vajranagini on Jun 12, 2011 0:31:09 GMT
>shrug< I can understand why you would think like you do; what I have said DOES sound oddly like "fundamentalist" thought, doesn't it? The essential difference being that the religion one follows is irrelevant; it is the active 'reaching out to God" that is the crucial factor, and also that it is not about "going to hell", but being "left behind", bound to the Wheel of Life and Death for another entire kalpa cycle, a timeperiod which could stretch to literally MILLIONS of years. Is that what you want? Or do you want to EVOLVE? To claim your birthright of spiritual evolution?
The Sufis describe it thus: "First consciousness arose in the mineral world... then minerality was left behind and became plant-based, then dying to planthood, consciousness became animal...and then finally left that to become human...all this I have been. So why should I fear leaving behind my humanity? I shall die to that and arise in 'angelic' form..."
The emphasis on "not much time left" is not my own; it is that of much greater minds who are aware of the relative brevity of the "window of opportunity' to make a great deal of progress in one's spiritual evolution. I have already stressed: if I /they are WRONG about all this, then no harm is done, but if I/they are RIGHT, then it becomes most urgent that one "sets to work" to make that progress and thus earn one's passage on the metaphorical "boat" that is due to leave very soon!
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Post by vajranagini on Jun 12, 2011 0:49:59 GMT
>shrug< It matters not a whit to me what you choose to do, or how you plan to go about evolving yourself; that is the fundamental [sic] difference between ME and the "fundies". My "passage' on that boat has already been paid in full; I have done all the necessary spiritual work and attained "liberation' in this lifetime.
But the majority of humanity has not done so, and has no intention of doing so. They are all too preoccupied with earthly concerns; they will only find out they have been 'left behind" AFTER the fact, when there is no longer any possibilty of 'evolution' within their grasp. Like I said, we have been warned that very soon "there will be no liberation for a very long time" and "long time" means a VERY "long time" indeed...as in "several hundred MILLENNIA".
Myself, I wish to go on with my spiritual heritage...the Sufis have a saying: Once we were mineral. Then we died to that and became plant. Then we evolved to the animal level, and finally we arose as human. We were being taken on a very long journey whose end could not be discerned. So why fear losing your "human' nature? You shall leave that behind in order to become "angelic"; why cling to "humanity"?
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