bod
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UGLE - MM (London), MMM RAM(Middx), OSM (London)
Posts: 1,296
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Post by bod on Jan 20, 2005 13:18:37 GMT
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Post by hollandr on Jan 21, 2005 10:30:58 GMT
I suspect my rather brief comment went unnoticed so here it is again.
If any brother wishes to penetrate the hidden mysteries of nature and science then he or she must learn meditation. One of the intermediate skills is clairvoyance that enables close inspection of the energy interactions of beings - visible and invisible.
Without clairvoyance (on each of the steps of Jacob's Ladder) we can only see a minute fraction of what is actually occurring all around us and within us.
Hence many of the mysteries become matters of observation.
For example, the several mechanisms of "love at first sight" can be observed by the spiritual scientist so that there is one mystery fewer.
Cheers
Russell
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Post by bevan on Jan 21, 2005 13:41:25 GMT
I'm confused Russell. Do you consider yourself to follow a more occult or a more mystic path? I was under the impression it was more occult as you (presumably) believe your active mind will direct a path for you? Apologies if I presume too much.
However, as you may well know, most psi skills rely on a certain kind of "no-mind" in order to receive "information" from the hidden planes. Or the zero point field as some refer to it these days. It is only the most adept (of whom I know only one) who are able to utilise both no-mind and occult mind at the same time. For most of us attempting both at once weakens the effect of either of them on their own.
In the meantime there are of course hidden mysteries of nature and science in both the outer and inner planes. I personally would not want to suggest that any one person's mystery is more valid than others.
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staffs
Administrator
Staffs
Posts: 3,295
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Post by staffs on Jan 21, 2005 15:58:20 GMT
There was al ink in the early days to an occult forum which offramp posted and included discussions on Golden Dawn ,Tarot,Wicca.
If anyone can find it i am sure Russell will find it interesting.
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Post by hollandr on Jan 21, 2005 21:51:38 GMT
Bevan
I would prefer to think of my path as spiritual science rather as practiced by Steiner.
Hence we have a process of observation, analysis, hypothesis, experiment and more observation.
In my experience much of this can be done in groups so that everyone may observe (or participate in) the experiment and compare observations and results.
In this way the mysteries become common to the group.
There are many rungs on Jacob's ladder beyond the mental (5.7 to 5.1) and the inner scientist needs to be functional (have all senses) on more and more rungs in order to progress.
You can see from this that receiving information is most relevant for those planes on which the scientist is not fully functional. On the functional planes, the scientist makes observations and then discusses them with physical and non-physical beings.
This is not so uncommon. You may recall that in the Golden Dawn the testing for Adeptus Minor involved the candidate visualising a complete temple with officers and the examiner inspecting the visualisation for completeness.
Adeptus Minor of course corresponds directly to control of the mental plane so that the above test was entirely appropriate although not a complete test of preparedness in itself.
Of course GD ran out of competent examiners within a decade or so.
Cheers
Russell
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Post by Yoki on Jan 25, 2005 23:47:37 GMT
I want to take a different tack concerning mysticism. I feel its does not come down to being a mystic or an occultist but to finding a happy balance using both of these disciplines. I have read that before we can reach the pinnacle of human wholeness we must work our way through and experience a number of personalty types. I would suggest that the same could be said of the two paths under discussion here. I have always considered myself a mystic preferring solitude and my own company. Many years ago a well known Co Masonic author and clairvoyant told me that this life was to be about interacting with the world and bring up a family. I was not to take myself of to the hills and meditate as I had all already been there and done that. As it happened life laid out that exact path and in the main I followed it faithfully, taking a look at occult and now ritualistic practices along the way. What I can say for sure is that it takes along time for humans to change or even rearrange their spots, as I still would love to head for the hills. This is not out of distain for the human condition but rather feeling swamped by it and I whould say that this is how most mystics are.
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ruffashlar
Member
Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
Posts: 2,184
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Post by ruffashlar on Jan 26, 2005 0:19:36 GMT
Perhaps you are just cut out for the monastic, contemplative life, Yoki. There are some people for whom it is the obvious path, and if that's you then there's no fighting it.
From what you say, you've been fighting it, not because you don't want to do it, but because on the contrary, it really fits you like a glove.
I say, embrace the solitude: feast upon asceticism!
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Post by taylorsman on Jan 26, 2005 7:13:30 GMT
I wish Yoki well in her endeavours. Not my scene asceticism, I'm far too sybaritic to say the least and enjoy the World, its fruits etc . In my outlook the Earth and indeed the Universe were made by God so we as his creatures should enjoy its manifold bounty not deny these gifts to ourselves. I don't have any time for self inflicted pain and suffering either so the likes of Opus Dei with its spiked garters and "disciplines" just ain't my scene but as long as it harms none other and you don't force it on me, then whatever floats your boat.
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ruffashlar
Member
Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
Posts: 2,184
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Post by ruffashlar on Jan 26, 2005 23:57:44 GMT
" Opus Dei with its spiked garters and 'disciplines' just ain't my scene" That's the kind of stuff they do at Torture Garden for fun " www.torturegarden.com/cgi-php/home.php"So you're really not all that sybaritic after all.
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Post by taylorsman on Jan 27, 2005 0:29:16 GMT
That lot's not my scene either Ruff, but as long as no unwilling person or minor is hurt then as far as I am concerned you can do what you like to yourself and I would not stop you.
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Post by Yoki on Jan 29, 2005 4:39:59 GMT
There has been misunderstanding, a lack of communication, the limitations of the written word, a failure to put forward a different worldview and a failure to understand it. Whatever the case I will try again. My view of life is based on the understanding that I have lived before and that I will return after this present body dies and live again.Through that process I refine and evolve the self. So with that in mind I except what life lies before me and get on with it. The main feature to date has been that of my role as wife and mother. Yes I could leave the world and join the local Carmelites who live in a stoned of monastery just down the road but were is that going to leave my family .Yes it would fit me like a glove but that is not my darma nor my karma. As to asceticism, why is there an automatic association with mysticism or even the learning of discipline. When I use the term self discipline I am referring to ego sculpting not flagellation of the physical type.
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Post by Seeker on Jan 29, 2005 5:57:22 GMT
Yoki, I agree there has been a lot of misunderstanding - to this topics loss. I agree completely with what you have said, I will go even further - if you had chosen before you came to the earth plain this time, that your lessons would be amongst other things a wife and mother - and when the normal mother/ wife bit went through a rough patch you had left it all and gone to the peace of a convent - when you passed over you would be very cross that you hadn't learnt the experiences you had planned and would have to do it all again until you got it right
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levi
New Member
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Post by levi on Jun 24, 2013 0:17:54 GMT
well, i see i am a few years latein seeing this post and question but i will answer it anyway as i know it is a commonly asked question. the answer is right in front of everyone but of course it is hidden in a clue. first, at the beginning of the second degree it makes clear that the lessons of each degree are found in that degree. i will not go into a long post quoting everything especially as i dont know who is reading this , i am assuming this is untyled. i am also assuming that those looking for this answer have done the second. the clue and answer is in 3 consecutive answers in the examination of an e.a.f. those being the clue !, Square 2, an implement being .......... the answer the hidden mysteries of nature and science (geometry) now.look for yourself what the ritual says - 3 questions linked together -on what? what is it? what is the object of research? you may at this point be interested in searching "geometry in nature" , "geometry in science", "geometry and freemasonry" or more relevantly, "the 47th problem of euclid " here is a link you may be interested in www.masonic-lodge-of-education.com/47th-problem-of-euclid.html
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Post by nventr on Jun 25, 2013 14:18:36 GMT
Twist me and turn me and show me the elf, I look in the water and saw . . .
Myself!
-Traditional Bridging into Brownie Girl Scouts
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Post by peter2 on Jul 4, 2013 21:03:14 GMT
Geometry (literally: measuring the Earth) does indeed lead to some of the hidden mysteries of nature and science. In addition there are mysteries involving natural processes and intelligence.
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