|
Post by lauderdale on Dec 18, 2007 12:22:14 GMT
|
|
|
Post by waynecowley on Dec 18, 2007 13:29:38 GMT
I also recall a series of American Cartoons on a Masonic Theme featuring Monkeys dressed in Regalia which I think was called "Old Grandpa" or something similar. Some, if not all of these, are on display in the upstairs bar in Cardiff Masonic Hall Wayne
|
|
|
Post by billmcelligott on Dec 18, 2007 14:15:22 GMT
Nothing to stop you doing so. Glad to see I have enthused some interest. I thought you were playing records.
|
|
|
Post by therondunn on Dec 18, 2007 14:18:09 GMT
You know, I find it kind of funny, and sad, that we would rather laugh about silliness than about a few folks trying to redefine freemasonry... but I guess if you are not a regular mason, its just one more group doing the same old same old.
Sorry to bother you folks with what I perceive as a problem. Y'all keep laughing.
|
|
|
Post by lauderdale on Dec 18, 2007 15:27:46 GMT
Bill, I can mulitask. Often I am listening through my earphones to music playing on my PC whilst posting to Fora such as this, typing up reports, answering e-mails etc, etc. Thanks however for the link to the "Wizard of Oz" pdf. At a quick speed-read it is far more interesting and deeper than the Judy Garland Movie. I will have to read it through one of these days. Perhaps it has a message veiled in allegory? Bro Wayne, thanks for the info. Can you find out the correct name for me of these as I would like to buy a set for my flat.
|
|
imakegarb
Member
One wee, sleeket, cowran, tim'rous beastie
Posts: 3,573
|
Post by imakegarb on Dec 18, 2007 15:36:45 GMT
Bro. Theron, I am as regular in my jurisdiction as you are in your's. The GL of California has never, EVER, claimed any authority over any other jurisdiction on earth. Including mine. Neither does my jurisdiction have any authority over the GL of CA. Each can make accurate observations about Freemasons who work in their area of influence, not outside it. So if the GL of CA, or you, say I'm irregular, there is no reason for me to accept it.
And I meet all the requirements detailed by Mackey and others. I am regular. That said . . .
Bro. Theron, I'm not inclined to think these folks are a threat to the wary. I understand they've made trouble elsewhere and that causes me concern. However, they can be driven from there. And kept out elsewhere.
Now I realize that it seems to you we laugh at those who seem to be tearing down Freemasonry. But I'll remind you She's survived much worth than this without breaking nail. These are just the latest and, (giggles) they're hardly the worst. They can't get at Her, they can't tear Her down. She'll be fine.
Be of good cheer, Bro. Theron.
|
|
|
Post by leonardo on Dec 18, 2007 15:41:59 GMT
Great post Bro. Karen!
|
|
|
Post by waynecowley on Dec 18, 2007 16:08:41 GMT
Bro Wayne, thanks for the info. Can you find out the correct name for me of these as I would like to buy a set for my flat. I'll have a look next time I am there but it may be a while as I don't go to the Cardiff lodges very often (even though I work in town) due to the problems in parking etc Wayne
|
|
|
Post by billmcelligott on Dec 18, 2007 16:14:56 GMT
OK, so if I see a man hitting another man on the head with a 4 x 2 then I do nothing because if that man came after me, I am quite capable of defending myself.
He cant hurt me because I am too clever, too big or just fast on my feet. I can not be injured.
But is that not why I should assist in defending those who are not ?
"I will not injure him myself or cause or suffer it to be so done by others". Is it just me that reads the ritual?
|
|
|
Post by devoutfreemason on Dec 18, 2007 17:46:23 GMT
First they came for the Jews and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the communists and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist. Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for me - and by then there was no one left to speak out for me. Pastor Martin Niemöller Theron is not a co Mason, nor a Female [as far as I know] and is not a non mainstream Freemason, yet he has spoken out. Because he believes in the rightful treatment of all, even those who maybe do not think his opinions are correct [maybe checking some of the threads here will remind readers]. That in my humble opinion deserves some respect. Having Holocaust victims and surviors in both my blood family and my Masonic family I find this post extremly insulting.
|
|
|
Post by billmcelligott on Dec 18, 2007 18:03:02 GMT
Take the matter up with
Pastor Martin Niemöller
|
|
|
Post by lauderdale on Dec 18, 2007 18:22:07 GMT
Right, what would I do in your scenario of the man being beaten with a bit of 4x2, or if you prefer a baseball bat, pick axe handle, batton etc? For simplicity let us assume I do not know the attacker nor the victim.
Well the one thing I would NOT do is intervene directly unless I was mob handed at the time, an unlikely situation. I would get out of the way, hoping I had not been observed by the assailant, and once at a safe distance use my mobile to phone 999 for the Police and Ambulance. That is the logical approach. There is absolutely no sense in trying to fend off the attacker if they are armed and probably far fitter than myself and ending up with two badly injured people instead of one. I am not a Martial Arts expert and of course I do not carry any weapon, defensive or otherwise so would not be a lot of use to be honest in such a situation.
I come originally from Glasgow, a hard city , and have seen fights between men and even gangs and was streetwise enough to realise that the one thing one did NOT do was to get involved. Indeed, in a one-on-one fight it has been know for both parties to turn on anyone unwise enough to intervene. There have been too many cases of "have a go heroes" ending up on a slab in the morgue in recent times and even the Police advise one not to get involved but to phone them instead.
Now I suppose I will get a load of sentimental tosh in reply to this. Well I really couldn't care less to be honest.
|
|
|
Post by devoutfreemason on Dec 18, 2007 18:38:39 GMT
Take the matter up with Pastor Martin Niemöller Seriously. to compare "clandestine" or "irregular" Masons to Nazi's is just way out of line. As a Mason and a Jew I am totally offended and disgusted.
|
|
|
Post by tws on Dec 18, 2007 18:39:02 GMT
Bro. Steve, no setimental tosh from me. As a licenced and trained Security Officer, I would draw my licensed Beretta 9mm and order him to drop his weapon, if he did not comply, and continued the assult, or threatened me, I would shoot until he stopped.
If he dies as a result, too bad.
|
|
|
Post by tws on Dec 18, 2007 18:49:31 GMT
Take the matter up with Pastor Martin Niemöller Seriously. to compare "clandestine" or "irregular" Masons to Nazi's is just way out of line. As a Mason and a Jew I am totally offended and disgusted. You seem to be going out of your way to be offended. Bro. Bill was simply offering that he would not countanence any person to be bullied. He would not passively stand by while anyone, regular, irregular, or Martian, was under vebal or physical attack. Speaking out against an unjust situation should in no way be construed to be somehow offensive. This piece is commonly used to illustrate the futility of passivity in the face of escalating intolerance.
|
|
imakegarb
Member
One wee, sleeket, cowran, tim'rous beastie
Posts: 3,573
|
Post by imakegarb on Dec 18, 2007 19:01:05 GMT
Take the matter up with Pastor Martin Niemöller Seriously. to compare "clandestine" or "irregular" Masons to Nazi's is just way out of line. As a Mason and a Jew I am totally offended and disgusted. Bro. Brad, I count survivors of the Holocaust among my friends. I was in Skokie during the Neo-Nazi's court battle to march there. I very much understand the sensitivity on this subject. Clearly Bro. Bill was comparing all these targeted Masons (not just those so inaccurately classified as you listed them) to the victims of the Nazis, not to the Nazis themselves. Indeed, Freemasons were targeted by the Nazis, so it's difficult to imagine anyone comparing Freemasons to Nazis. Indeed, Bro. Bill's post much mirrors my own reference to the much earlier atrocities committed by the Inquisition. I certainly compared Freemasons to the victims of the Inquisition, not to the Inquisition. Bro. Bill's post makes no sense otherwise and I cannot see how it could be at all interpreted as saying Bro. Bill is comparing Freemasons to Nazis. So, unless you are seeking to be offended, I can make no sense or your offense. For it cannot be that you are offended by all mention o the Holocaust. To never mention it is to cause it to be forgotten. And that it must never be.
|
|
|
Post by devoutfreemason on Dec 18, 2007 19:06:08 GMT
Seriously. to compare "clandestine" or "irregular" Masons to Nazi's is just way out of line. As a Mason and a Jew I am totally offended and disgusted. Bro. Brad, I count survivors of the Holocaust among my friends. I was in Skokie during the Neo-Nazi's court battle to march there. I very much understand the sensitivity on this subject. Clearly Bro. Bill was comparing all Masons (not just those so inaccurately classified as you listed them) to the victims of the Nazis, not to the Nazis themselves. Indeed, Freemasons were targeted by the Nazis, so it's difficult to imagine anyone comparing Freemasons to Nazis. Indeed, Bro. Bill's post much mirrors my own reference to the much earlier atrocities committed by the Inquisition. I certainly compared Freemasons to the victims of the Inquisition, not to the Inquisition. Bro. Bill's post makes no sense otherwise and I cannot see how it could be at all interpreted as saying Bro. Bill is comparing Freemasons to Nazis. So, unless you are seeking to be offended, I can make no sense or your offense. For it cannot be that you are offended by all mention o the Holocaust. To never mention it is to cause it to be forgotten. And that it must never be. Bro. Karen, I appreciate your post. At the same time it is not up to you or anyone lse to determine what I find offensive. If you would be so kind as to re read Bill's post his target is made clear. He compared Theron Dunn to being someone who would cry out against Nazi's. Theron is crying out against anyone he deems "irregular" and "clandestine" therefore the "irregular" and "clandestine" Masons take the place of the Nazi's mentioned in the quote. Is that so hard to see? Brad
|
|
|
Post by devoutfreemason on Dec 18, 2007 19:07:04 GMT
Seriously. to compare "clandestine" or "irregular" Masons to Nazi's is just way out of line. As a Mason and a Jew I am totally offended and disgusted. You seem to be going out of your way to be offended. Bro. Bill was simply offering that he would not countanence any person to be bullied. He would not passively stand by while anyone, regular, irregular, or Martian, was under vebal or physical attack. Speaking out against an unjust situation should in no way be construed to be somehow offensive. This piece is commonly used to illustrate the futility of passivity in the face of escalating intolerance. I would appreciate it if you would live up to your word in another thread and stop posting in my direction. Thanks, Brad
|
|
|
Post by tws on Dec 18, 2007 19:20:24 GMT
I would appreciate it if you would live up to your word in another thread and stop posting in my direction. Thanks, Brad Asking pointed questions should not be thought of as picking on someone. That you choose to see it that way is a personal issue. And, I will post where ever I want and on whatever subject I wish.
|
|
|
Post by devoutfreemason on Dec 18, 2007 19:22:31 GMT
I would appreciate it if you would live up to your word in another thread and stop posting in my direction. Thanks, Brad Asking pointed questions should not be thought of as picking on someone. That you choose to see it that way is a personal issue. And, I will post where ever I want and on whatever subject I wish. You will get zero replies from me, I have nothing to say to you. Good Luck, Brad
|
|