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Post by lauderdale on Sept 14, 2008 9:00:33 GMT
Could it be that the edifice that Freemasonry is to build is the bridge within that closes that Internal Disconnect?
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Post by hollandr on Sept 14, 2008 9:13:36 GMT
Well there are at least 3 internal disconnects, 2 of which are actually barriers and may be eroded while a third is actively opposed to the rule of spirit
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 14, 2008 20:45:11 GMT
Well there are at least 3 internal disconnects, 2 of which are actually barriers and may be eroded while a third is actively opposed to the rule of spirit. Still no divulgence!? Whatever these disconnects may be according to any one interpretation, they are often overcome by the unready, unpreparded and uninstructed in the distinctions between the inner and outer worlds. Mysticism / Schizophrenia According to Prof. Joseph Campbell ( Myths to Live By, 1993, org. 1972, p.209): In his account of shamanism, Dr. Silverman described how (Jung, op cit., pp.206/7):
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Post by hollandr on Sept 14, 2008 23:05:01 GMT
>You have 30 seconds to divulge these three
There are 2 substantial barriers:
- on subplane 7.4 (lowest etheric) there is a barrier that limits the physical body in detecting etheric energies
- on subplane 5.4 (highest subplane of the lower mind) there is a barrier that restricts flow from the higher mind to the lower mind
Both of these barriers may be eroded by right living and suitable practices e.g. yoga or gardening, and meditation or philosophy
These barriers may also be penetrated and removed by direct intervention. I have observed both events taking hours or minutes
The more important disconnect is the intelligence that sits at the top of the personality mind (5.4) and operates the defence systems. This entity conceals itself by various means including being invisible, disguising itself as some great spiritual figure and instructing the human that the entity is the human or that the entity does not exist.
I have observed the entity faking meditation experiences to keep the human from achieving contact with higher forces.
The entity might be called Personal Will. The Personal Will commonly explains that it is really the spiritual will and therefore it should be obeyed.
The Personal Will is happy to discard anything that threatens its self-esteem. It will allow the physical body to die rather than admit that it is mistaken. It will allow relationships to collapse rather than be vulnerable.
There are other disconnects that occur through dislocation of subplanes. Subplanes allow energy to flow to the next lower subplane. If the lower is out of alignment the energy flow is constricted and turbulent.
This produces loss of fine motor skills on emotional and physical levels. Often this is accompanied by a vertebra out of alignment at the corresponding point in the spine
On the densest level it is relatively common to find the etheric body displaced about a centimeter from the physical body. Since the etheric body is the sensing body, this results in one's hand being a centimeter away from where one feels that it is.
The dislocation of subplanes is easily fixed should that be appropriate
Cheers
Russell
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 15, 2008 8:20:01 GMT
The more important disconnect is the intelligence that sits at the top of the personality mind (5.4) and operates the defence systems. This entity conceals itself by various means including being invisible, disguising itself as some great spiritual figure and instructing the human that the entity is the human or that the entity does not exist. The quintessential mystical experience is that of truly knowing the unity of all that is. Saying "this entity" suggests multiplicity: Saying "this aspect" acknowledges that unity.
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Post by hollandr on Sept 15, 2008 12:52:03 GMT
>(<Prometheus thinks to Prometheus> isn't that what Prometheus said?!?!)
Perhaps I have put more emphasis on the self-intelligent qualities of the disconnect and its ability to protect itself, program the human and if necessary sacrifice all other beings
In the Castenada writings Don Juan explains that the mind is a "foreign installation". This presumably means that the mind is alienated from the best interests of the human and thereby serving different interests.
This is perhaps a little strong in some cases but pretty much true for many humans
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Post by hollandr on Sept 15, 2008 12:56:11 GMT
>Saying "this entity" suggests multiplicity: Saying "this aspect" acknowledges that unity.
The agenda of the entity is separative but it does like to present itself in the best light by according with the beliefs of the host human
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Post by maximus on Sept 15, 2008 13:25:40 GMT
>Saying "this entity" suggests multiplicity: Saying "this aspect" acknowledges that unity. The agenda of the entity is separative but it does like to present itself in the best light by according with the beliefs of the host human Here you are making an assertion, i.e., that there is a foriegn "entity" controlling our thought proccess from without. Why ascribe a function of our personality to an outside influence? It is well known that our consciousness has different levels, some of which we are not aware ordinarily. It is the function of the various disciplines of spirituality to attempt to bring these into harmony. Why assert that there is a controlling "entity?" [/quote]
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 15, 2008 15:00:07 GMT
Well said.
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 15, 2008 15:23:59 GMT
In the Castenada writings Don Juan explains that the mind is a "foreign installation". This presumably means that the mind is alienated from the best interests of the human and thereby serving different interests. Again with willful credulity!? I thought Castenada had been well and truly debunked here yonks ago. The bloke was an utter fraud! we read:
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Post by hollandr on Sept 15, 2008 22:19:08 GMT
Philip
I knew you could not resist Castenada and the academic debunkers.
For myself I learned several spiritual techniques from Don Juan that I have not seen published elsewhere.
For example his technique for meeting your personal death is quite easy and I have taught it to several.
And his method of determining whether a human is slowly dying is also most interesting
Perhaps the academics had other interests
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Post by hollandr on Sept 15, 2008 22:22:51 GMT
>Here you are making an assertion, i.e., that there is a foriegn "entity" controlling our thought proccess from without.
Quite so - although the entity is inside our mental structures
Now how can we test that?
It is a bit tricky as if it is true then the entity will deny its existence and attempt to subvert the investigation through controlling the mental processes
But with huge effort it is possible to make the test - rising beyond control by the mind so as to make a direct observation
A friend spent 4 hours a night for almost a week struggling to see the entity before finally succeeding at 2 am. She then said that it was obvious to her that in the past when she thought she was serving the greater good that she was actually serving her Personal Will
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 16, 2008 8:17:26 GMT
Philip I knew you could not resist Castenada and the academic debunkers. For myself I learned several spiritual techniques from Don Juan that I have not seen published elsewhere. For example his technique for meeting your personal death is quite easy and I have taught it to several. And his method of determining whether a human is slowly dying is also most interesting Perhaps the academics had other interests I suggest their other interest is truth. Castenada has been proven to be a liar and a cheat. As with the most plausible liars he may have sprinkled his deceits with grains of truth, which in his case are shown to have been plagiarized. Just because YOU!? have not seen what he wrote published elsewhere means nothing—Others have done so—Are you familiar with the works of Barbara Myerhoff, referred to above?
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 16, 2008 8:20:54 GMT
But with huge effort it is possible to make the test - rising beyond control by the mind so as to make a direct observation Is this it?
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Post by hollandr on Sept 16, 2008 8:51:14 GMT
>As with the most plausible liars he may have sprinkled his deceits with grains of truth,
I have found his work to be most valuable in particular his accounts of the mind and death.
A friend belonged to Castenada's group in California over some years and found the practical work to be most valuable also.
Thus I leave academics to their own pursuits. No doubt they receive their own satisfactions
It might be interesting to start another thread to demonstrate whether Castaneda was original in that concept of the mind as a foreign installation- although he himself claims that the concept is not his own so I am not too sure of the value.
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Post by hollandr on Sept 16, 2008 9:07:34 GMT
But back to this thread - I wonder if any forumite has any experience of the mind as foreign to their essence.
One symptom might be when the mind regularly distracts attempts to consider deeper issues - perhaps by becoming bored, losing the thread of thoughts or throwing up distracting images and thoughts
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Post by lauderdale on Sept 16, 2008 9:27:48 GMT
Indeed so Bro Russell.
Last year I was in Oxford meeting with Stewart Edwards at the Ashmolean Museum. As we waked he tried it discuss a serious matter with me but I kept being distracted and directing the course of the discussion onto trivial and mundane matters. This was not an intentional move on my part and indeed I was not aware of doing so until Stewart drew my attention to this. It wasn't that the topic under discussion was in any way unpleasant to me, simply that we both felt that something did not want the matter to be spoken about.
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Post by hollandr on Sept 16, 2008 10:23:57 GMT
>we both felt that something did not want the matter to be spoken about.
Unconscious avoidance is very common.
But what is the intelligence managing the avoidance?
And will we tolerate being managed by it?
Or is it just too hard to think about it?
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 16, 2008 10:44:17 GMT
Thus I leave academics to their own pursuits. No doubt they receive their own satisfactions...
...although he himself claims that the concept is not his own so I am not too sure of the value. Indeed! Well, as you chose not to address the clear evidence, I will prefer the findings of those who know what they are talking about: I guess you are of Oscar Wilde's opinion: " Arguments are to be avoided: they are always vulgar and often convincing."
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Tamrin
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Post by Tamrin on Sept 16, 2008 10:46:07 GMT
I wonder if any forumite has any experience of the mind as foreign to their essence. Classic symptom of schizophrenia.
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