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Post by boreades on Mar 16, 2013 16:14:26 GMT
I can't remember being told the significance of a few things in an image we're very used to seeing. What angle does the compass make, and why? Why does the compass cross the compass at the eigth division on the ruler? Does anyone know the answer?
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Post by beejay on Mar 17, 2013 2:04:49 GMT
In my view the compasses represent the Light from on high and the square represent the temple that extends from E to W etc.
In that case the angle of the compasses does not matter.
If the angle is made to be 60 degrees then it may refer to the current location of Jerusalem (the city of the Canaanite god Shalim) see Civilisation One by Br Knight
But Blake makes it closer to 90 degrees in his Ancient of Days.
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Post by billmcelligott on Mar 17, 2013 21:23:49 GMT
If we take the Grand master jewel as a guide ? that is if you wish to refer to UGLE www.ugle.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/book-of-constitutions-2012-online-plates.pdfNo. 1. THE GRAND MASTER. The compasses extended over an arc of 45°, with the segment of a circle at the points and a gold plate included, on which is to be represented an eye within a triangle, both irradiated If you move down the plates , you could make a case for the angles to create some symetry of other designs. But it does not seem at a glance to give ant further explanation.
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Post by boreades on Mar 18, 2013 21:36:52 GMT
If we take the Grand master jewel as a guide ? that is if you wish to refer to UGLE www.ugle.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/book-of-constitutions-2012-online-plates.pdfNo. 1. THE GRAND MASTER. The compasses extended over an arc of 45°, with the segment of a circle at the points and a gold plate included, on which is to be represented an eye within a triangle, both irradiated If you move down the plates , you could make a case for the angles to create some symetry of other designs. But it does not seem at a glance to give ant further explanation. Sorry, I'm confused. Plate No 1 shows a scale with compasses opened to 35 degrees (if I am counting correctly). But maybe it's another thing that's symbolic and not meant to be taken literally? Or can I get esoteric and say the compasses are the frame outside of 33 degrees? Not UGLE degrees of course, perhaps other Rites?
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Post by beejay on Mar 19, 2013 1:42:13 GMT
It may be of use to distinguish emblems from symbols. Emblems are arbitrary associations while symbols are rather like TV antennae - properly constructed to establish a resonance with an external field - hence perhaps the great emphasis on geometry as an entry to the Mysteries.
A little dowsing will demonstrate the opening of the compasses with the greatest resonance in that particular external field.
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Tamrin
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Nosce te ipsum
Posts: 3,586
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Post by Tamrin on Mar 19, 2013 8:20:05 GMT
A little dowsing will demonstrate the opening of the compasses with the greatest resonance in that particular external field. Does dowsing work?[ The Skeptics Dictionary, Robert Todd Carroll, (Excerpt - Linked Above)]
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Post by boreades on Apr 16, 2013 23:18:08 GMT
Well, I know I asked about compasses, so I'm not sure how we got to dowsing. Except that a past Deputy Grand Master from NSW Oz tells me it was part of his training at Agricultural College. Is it masonic because it's symbolic and not literal?
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Post by beejay on Apr 17, 2013 2:59:47 GMT
If Masonry were speculative we could speculate forever about the symbolism. If Masonry were a science then we could use some means for measuring the truth of any particular proposition - and thereby demonstrate why Truth is one of the 3 principles of Masonry. Perhaps dowsing is one of the practices veiled by the working tools that measure trueness.
Masonry deals with emblems and symbols. A symbol is isomorphic (same shape) to some aspect of the target Reality and thereby facilitates a conscious connection with that aspect of Reality. Emblems are arbitrary associations.
Hence if all of Masonry is symbolic then it is (or at least used to be) isomorphic to the relevant aspects of Reality. Thus the question of what is symbolic and what is literal in Masonry is not entirely valid. For example, is standing erect a symbolic act or does it have direct and literal effects? The military takes standing erect to be literal and expects moral effects to flow.
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Tamrin
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Nosce te ipsum
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Post by Tamrin on Apr 17, 2013 20:34:08 GMT
If Masonry were speculative we could speculate forever about the symbolism. If Masonry were a science then we could use some means for measuring the truth of any particular proposition - and thereby demonstrate why Truth is one of the 3 principles of Masonry. Perhaps dowsing is one of the practices veiled by the working tools that measure trueness. We are unlikely to arrive at the truth of the matter where the means proposed for doing so (dowsing) is a pseudoscience. If you want some concrete evidence of why truth is one of the 3 grand principles on which Freemasonry is founded, you need look no further than the practices of operative stonemasons whose work, we are told, in erecting temporal buildings would not permit them "...to deviate one hair's breadth to the right or to the left..." Construct a building or a hypothesis without regard for truth and it will not stand.
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Post by hokmah3579 on Oct 23, 2014 1:18:13 GMT
I can't remember being told the significance of a few things in an image we're very used to seeing. What angle does the compass make, and why? Why does the compass cross the compass at the eigth division on the ruler? Does anyone know the answer? Brother the compasses are set at 60° because the three angles of an equilateral triangle are opened at 60° the triangle symbolizes The spiritual realm compasses trace a perfect circle which is the symbol for the spirit . The square is a right angle formed by two right lines it is adapted onto a plane surface and belongs only to geometry earth measurement that trigonometry which deals only with planes and with the earth which the ancient adepts supposed to be a plane hence the symbolism alludes to physical things. Collectively the symbolism alludes to the spirit and the body of man or the earth and the heavenly firmament above. Albert Pike explains these concepts perfectly on page 11 of morals and dogma. This idea is further symbolized by the alchemical "Rebis".
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Post by peter2 on Oct 23, 2014 3:43:20 GMT
That is certainly a plausible response but are there other explanations?
How would I choose between them?
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Post by elijah on Oct 23, 2014 10:06:54 GMT
7 spectrum's of visible light in 3 dimensions 3 planes manifesting matter threw a 8 plane system connected to the infinite expansion of cosmos measuring the light creates a tangible reality from thought form on earth as it is in heaven a compass on 8 or infinity might measure the invisible this is just my theory the figure 8 pattern is one of the most important symbols of creation thus a strong foundation can only be created threw truth beauty and goodness you will get your answer if you truly want it but be warned just like a high setting on a toaster too much intensity burns just like those flickering street lamps draw moths and flys im not a mason but i was burned and truly changed guess i had it coming just forgot lol
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Post by peter2 on Oct 23, 2014 11:01:32 GMT
In the Hindu system there are 7 planes and 5 electricities making a 12 fold system underpinning Existence.
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Post by elijah on Oct 23, 2014 22:58:58 GMT
would the 5 electrics have a relation with 5 symmetrical solids and would the light of the 7 planes get trapped in these electric symmetrical forms and condense into matter? does the square create the right angles to use the light and the compass degrees place the light into its proper position within space time like how the pyramids look like squares placed on top of each other when viewed from above but give the illusion of a three dimensional triangle when one looks at it from land
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Post by peter2 on Oct 24, 2014 2:39:07 GMT
The 5 electricities exist behind and provide the source for manifested Existence
The 5 platonic solids are better related to the 5 elements. The electricities give rise to the elements and are more fundamental than the lights of the planes.
>does the square create the right angles to use the light and the compass degrees place the light into its proper position within space time
The square and the compasses are symbolic veilings of cosmic processes that occur in this universe.
Not all Masonic pavements are rectangular.
>give the illusion of a three dimensional triangle
Your visual process may need to proceed in more dimensions.
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Post by elijah on Oct 24, 2014 5:17:32 GMT
thanks for clearing that up peter2 i was a bit vague in my statement concerning the squares and pyramids step pyramids particularly seem to be a series of squares that form a triangular shape would the building of these pyramids require the same process as the great pyramids in egypt does the compass have any symbolic meaning that would relate to this photo
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Post by peter2 on Oct 24, 2014 7:03:09 GMT
It is better to consider the compasses as representing rays of energy or light.
The Great Pyramid in Egypt seems to have been built by grinding limestone from the on-site quarry to make a form of concrete - with the blocks cast on the pyramid itself - hence exact fits. Odd pieces of straw can be found inside the blocks.
As a result of this process the quarry was only just big enough for the amount of stone required for the blocks. There was not the large amount of waste caused by cutting blocks from irregular slabs.
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pan0ptic
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Post by pan0ptic on Nov 27, 2015 21:22:05 GMT
Why does the compass cross the compass at the eigth division on the ruler? Does anyone know the answer? Equilateral[ism] superseded by aesthetic
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Post by peter2 on Nov 28, 2015 1:13:19 GMT
In this case the figure is an artist's depiction based on the relatively modern practice of placing an English letter in the centre.
Of course if God is English then this makes complete sense.
Are there ancient depictions of the square and compasses - or only depictions after the genuine secrets were declared lost in 1727?
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pan0ptic
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Post by pan0ptic on Nov 30, 2015 21:43:27 GMT
Who, me? No idea. But I do recall the number eight being important because of its positional dexterity.Maybe that has something to do with the image?
pan
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