giovanni
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 10:12:33 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 13, 2005 10:12:33 GMT
Hi to all! I attended a meeting on Hermetics in Siena. Wonderful! The Cathedral is a true masterpiece, formally Christian catholic but substantially hermetic. The church was built where once existed a pagan temple of Artemis, the virgin goddess. The sacrum loci was never forgotten. It is not possible to summarize the items that have been thoroughly exposed during the meeting. I want, however, draw your attention on a tile of the dome, which has quite impressed me. The tile is called that of the ascension to the mount of the fortune and of the wisdom. From the bottom right: the Fortune is a young woman, in precarious equilibrium having one foot on a boat and the other one on a sphere. Some men are sitting, some other discuss. Two of them are instead walking toward the peak. On earth, various animals which sneak. This means that man who searches for wisdom must be humble, but I read it also as an exhortation to go ahead without excessive hurry, but rather with perseverance (as the turtle = festina lente). On the top, a woman who gives the palm, symbol of heroism and inner peace, to Socrates, who preferred to die rather than to betray his ideals; and the book of wisdom to Crates, a Cynic philosopher of the 4th century after Christ. (Cynic were called the members of a sect of ancient Greek philosophers who believed virtue to be the only good and self-control to be the only means of achieving virtue). Crates gets rid of metals and other valuable things. This woman is supposed to be Isis, since this tile is opposite to another one, representing Osiris. The Latin inscriptions says: Come here men, climb the harsh mountain, the beautiful results of your labor will be palm (= wisdom) [and] inner peace. * * * Later I will show a strange inscription which is reproduced on the southern exterior wall of the church.
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giovanni
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 12:35:55 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 13, 2005 12:35:55 GMT
Later I will show a strange inscription which is reproduced on the southern exterior wall of the church. here I am! On the exterior wall of the Dome, there is a very strange inscription: SATOR AREPO TENET OPERA ROTAS This is a palindrome, i. e. it may be read the same backward or forward. The priests said always that it has an apotropaic meaning: it protects the church against fire. I cannot agree. Let's translate it. SATOR means the seeder, the man who seeds; AREPO This has opened a tough discussion. Some argued that it is an Etruscan word, meaning "plow"., but the out coming translation is meaningless. More simply: Romans cut the double consonant while writing stones; so the exact word is A(R)REPO = to sneak. TENET = 3rd singular of "to keep" OPERA = work ROTAS = wheels. So, this is the right translation: I am the seeder, I sneak everywhere, my work keeps (together) the wheels (of the universe). Now tell me if the foregoing is Christian catholic!
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 13:56:04 GMT
Post by ingo on Jun 13, 2005 13:56:04 GMT
Giovanni, while reading Apuleius I see that the mystieres of Isis and Soiris were very popular in the roman empire. Maybe it is a rest of it.....
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giovanni
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 14:06:54 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 13, 2005 14:06:54 GMT
Correct!
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ruffashlar
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Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
Posts: 2,184
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 18:39:30 GMT
Post by ruffashlar on Jun 13, 2005 18:39:30 GMT
Giovanni, This is bizarre. Yesterday, for no apparent reason, I started thinking about just this inscription. Now why was that? This is what is called a double acrostic, i.e., it reads the same forwards and top-to-bottom as it reads backwards and bottom-to-top; and, top-to-bottom from the left side to the right, as well as bottom-to-top from the right side to the left. It will thus be logically impossible for AREPO to have had an intended double R; it would destroy the double acrostic. SATOR means, as you said, the seeder; or, as we would say, the sower. It is etymologically identical to Saturnus, the seed-planting god of Spring whose licentious festival corresponds to Christmas. AREPO is best treated as a personal name: Arepo the sower. TENET, he holds, maintains. OPERA, through (his) work. ROTAS, wheels or cycles; the grammatical object. So we have, "Arepo the sower in his work holds the wheels". This might be creatively glossed as "Arepo the sower through his works maintains the cosmic spheres". Or something The inscription is considered to refer to God, or a god, doing the job of running the immense machine of the universe, through the work of continually planting the germ of creative energy. Then again, it might equally mean that whoever instills the seeds of learning, and the beginnings of new ideas, is the one who holds real power in the world. However, the thing that makes me think it refers to God, and to a specifically Christian idea of God, is the fact that the whole inscription is a double anagram of PATER NOSTER, preceded and succeeded by the A(lpha) and O(mega). In fact, it is only a complete double anagram when written as an acrostic .............................A .............................P .............................A .............................T .............................E .............................R ...................APATERNOSTERO .............................O .............................S .............................T .............................E .............................R .............................O A Latin cross is thus formed, the vertical and horizontal arms of which each comprise thirteen letters: twelve Apostles and the One.
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 19:56:21 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jun 13, 2005 19:56:21 GMT
Now this is strange. I too often think on the Sator Arepo palindromic square and sometimes write it on a piece of paper when I am faced with some puzzle I cannot resolve. Thereafter I will often find a solution in a way I had not previously considered or even in an unorthodox manner.
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ruffashlar
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Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 20:50:28 GMT
Post by ruffashlar on Jun 13, 2005 20:50:28 GMT
I myself first encountered the verse in the opening chapter of Richard Carpenter's children's novel Catweazle, later immortalised for television by Geoffrey Bayldon. I believe I was already hopelessly besotted by the occult even at that stage (about eleven, I think). The mnemonic power of the sonorous, magic-sounding words make the verse an ideal hocus-pocus for any situation, and thus make an excellent spell. I found they were particularly resonant when pronounced while making the Invoking Pentagram. Aged twelve or thirteen I was given, as a birthday present, S.L.M.Mathers' The Key of Solomon the King. First published in 1888, the book is now out of copyright and available online. Observe Figure 12 of Plate II - www.sacred-texts.com/grim/kos/kos25.htm - in which the figure occurs, appropriately enough, in a sigil to be consecrated to the powers of Saturn, "of great value against adversities". Unusually, it is given in Hebrew letters. Mathers goes on: "It will be seen at a glance that it is a square of five, giving twenty-five letters, which, added to the unity [the convention of adding one in Gematria], gives twenty-six, the numerical value of IHVH." He then goes on to compare this inscription with the accompaniying text inscribed in the roundel of the intended talisman:- "The Hebrew versicle surrounding it is taken from Psalm lxxii. 8, 'His dominion shall be also from the one sea to the other, and from the flood unto the world's end.' This passage consists also of exactly twenty-five letters, and its total numerical value (considering the final letters with increased numbers), added to that of the Name Elohim, is exactly equal to the total numerical value of the twenty-five letters in the Square."
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 20:59:21 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jun 13, 2005 20:59:21 GMT
Thanks Ruff, very useful. Now some of that reminds me of "The Secret Lore of Magic" by Idries Shah. I presume you have read it and may even have a copy.
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ruffashlar
Member
Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
Posts: 2,184
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Siena
Jun 13, 2005 21:47:11 GMT
Post by ruffashlar on Jun 13, 2005 21:47:11 GMT
Never afraid to admit to the gaping holes in my erudition, I have not read it. However, I may have read the matter, and perhaps even the argument. As you are an A.E. Waite aficionado, I trust you will be familiar with his entertaining, if at times irritatingly tabloid, The Book of Black Magic and Pacts. He discusses the Clavicula there at some length, as the real original of the many derivative tomes and even (e.g., Queen of Hairy Flies) gutless fakes which populate that tenebrous genre, the Grimoire.
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 0:19:51 GMT
Post by sid on Jun 14, 2005 0:19:51 GMT
Later I will show a strange inscription which is reproduced on the southern exterior wall of the church. here I am! On the exterior wall of the Dome, there is a very strange inscription: SATOR AREPO TENET OPERA ROTAS This is a palindrome, i. e. it may be read the same backward or forward. The priests said always that it has an apotropaic meaning: it protects the church against fire. I cannot agree. Let's translate it. SATOR means the seeder, the man who seeds; AREPO This has opened a tough discussion. Some argued that it is an Etruscan word, meaning "plow"., but the out coming translation is meaningless. More simply: Romans cut the double consonant while writing stones; so the exact word is A(R)REPO = to sneak. TENET = 3rd singular of "to keep" OPERA = work ROTAS = wheels. So, this is the right translation: I am the seeder, I sneak everywhere, my work keeps (together) the wheels (of the universe). Now tell me if the foregoing is Christian catholic! This is in the Egyptian Coptic Churches that were cut into the rock in Africa. I believe there are about 14 of them. When viewed from the air, they look like the Temple in the small picture I was asking about with reference to the numbering of the stones of the Temple. The drawing is from the Masonic KT I believe. What you have shown here is believed to be Templar (?), but that said it also hides the following word(s): -- T-- -- E-- TENET -- E-- -- T-- If one uses the Latin alphabet and the numerical value in sequence as Studion does, one arrives at the number 104 which is 4 x 26 i.e., CR and the first 3 Brothers. The number 26 is also the 'number' of each brother of the R+C Fraternity, and if you count the letters at the close of the Fama you will find that there are also 26 in number. Interestingly, the second group of 4 Brothers from the Fama are each of the number 351 which is the triangulation of the number 26. 351 x 4 for each Brother = 1404 which is the 'year' the R+C Fraternity was founded. T= 18 + T E= 05 + E N= 12 E= 05 + E T= 18 + T -------------- = 58 + 36 (T) + 10 (N) = 104 The letters 'TEN' = 35 (4 x 35 = 140) AGLA = 35 (?) ------------- Place your Tarot cards in the following way. 1 - 22 (0) 2 - 21 3 - 20 4 - 19 5 - 18 6 - 17 7 - 16 8 - 15 9 - 14 10 - 13 11 - 12
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 0:34:47 GMT
Post by sid on Jun 14, 2005 0:34:47 GMT
Giovanni, This is bizarre. Yesterday, for no apparent reason, I started thinking about just this inscription. Now why was that? This is what is called a double acrostic, i.e., it reads the same forwards and top-to-bottom as it reads backwards and bottom-to-top; and, top-to-bottom from the left side to the right, as well as bottom-to-top from the right side to the left. It will thus be logically impossible for AREPO to have had an intended double R; it would destroy the double acrostic. SATOR means, as you said, the seeder; or, as we would say, the sower. It is etymologically identical to Saturnus, the seed-planting god of Spring whose licentious festival corresponds to Christmas. AREPO is best treated as a personal name: Arepo the sower. TENET, he holds, maintains. OPERA, through (his) work. ROTAS, wheels or cycles; the grammatical object. So we have, "Arepo the sower in his work holds the wheels". This might be creatively glossed as "Arepo the sower through his works maintains the cosmic spheres". Or something The inscription is considered to refer to God, or a god, doing the job of running the immense machine of the universe, through the work of continually planting the germ of creative energy. Then again, it might equally mean that whoever instills the seeds of learning, and the beginnings of new ideas, is the one who holds real power in the world. However, the thing that makes me think it refers to God, and to a specifically Christian idea of God, is the fact that the whole inscription is a double anagram of PATER NOSTER, preceded and succeeded by the A(lpha) and O(mega). In fact, it is only a complete double anagram when written as an acrostic .............................A .............................P .............................A .............................T .............................E .............................R ...................APATERNOSTERO .............................O .............................S .............................T .............................E .............................R .............................O A Latin cross is thus formed, the vertical and horizontal arms of which each comprise thirteen letters: twelve Apostles and the One. Interesting reading Ruff, Could you perhaps explain the A & O bit, please? .............................A .............................P .............................A .............................T .............................E .............................R ...................APATERNOSTERO .............................O .............................S .............................T .............................E .............................R .............................O I am more inclined to look at the number 24 = 24 Elders of the 'clock of God', but that would be pure speculation on my part.
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giovanni
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odi profanum vulgus, et arceo
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 7:48:16 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 14, 2005 7:48:16 GMT
Giovanni, This is what is called a double acrostic, i.e., it reads the same forwards and top-to-bottom as it reads backwards and bottom-to-top; and, top-to-bottom from the left side to the right, as well as bottom-to-top from the right side to the left. It will thus be logically impossible for AREPO to have had an intended double R; it would destroy the double acrostic. I could agree with you, Ruff, had they written ARREPO. But they wrote AREPO. I am absolutely sure that Romans used to eliminate the double consonant in stone inscriptions. Arepo, as personal name, does not exist. It is quite interesting your interpretation of the cross: I need to think it over.
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 9:19:15 GMT
Post by whistler on Jun 14, 2005 9:19:15 GMT
On the Siena Tile,. Is it possible we are looking at above and below - maybe the workers on one level and the thinkers on the upper level
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giovanni
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odi profanum vulgus, et arceo
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 9:30:43 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 14, 2005 9:30:43 GMT
Maybe Whistler. In this case the thought, i. e. the ability of thinking, is the premium given to those who have worked their inner
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 9:54:10 GMT
Post by whistler on Jun 14, 2005 9:54:10 GMT
Maybe Whistler. In this case the thought, i. e. the ability of thinking, is the premium given to those who have worked their inner Mmmm ok, Why is the mast of the boat broken, the wind in the sail takes her to the rocks upon which we have the Globe... Does that suggest a flow on conciousness from the ravages of the sea . is the Man in the middle holding back the others or is he pointing to where they have come from.
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giovanni
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odi profanum vulgus, et arceo
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 10:10:13 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 14, 2005 10:10:13 GMT
The wind means, IMO, that the Fortune has no exact direction, it is whimsical.
The man in the middle seems to say to the others, which appear skeptic, that his intention is to go, whatever they think. In fact, some people could have tried to discourage us when we decided to come into Freemasonry.
I repeat: these are my personal thoughts, I am not in possession of the Truth...
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ruffashlar
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Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
Posts: 2,184
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 11:59:59 GMT
Post by ruffashlar on Jun 14, 2005 11:59:59 GMT
Sid asks: "Interesting reading Ruff, Could you perhaps explain the A & O bit, please?"
I quote myself: "the whole inscription is a double anagram of PATER NOSTER, preceded and succeeded by the A(lpha) and O(mega)."
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ruffashlar
Member
Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
Posts: 2,184
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 12:12:39 GMT
Post by ruffashlar on Jun 14, 2005 12:12:39 GMT
I could agree with you, Ruff, had they written ARREPO. But they wrote AREPO. I am absolutely sure that Romans used to eliminate the double consonant in stone inscriptions. Arepo, as personal name, does not exist.
Well, supposing you are right, and AREPO is a variant of ARREPO, that gives us:-
I, the sower, move slowly: who holds the wheels, "Work!"
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giovanni
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odi profanum vulgus, et arceo
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 12:42:31 GMT
Post by giovanni on Jun 14, 2005 12:42:31 GMT
So I translated it.
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Siena
Jun 14, 2005 16:50:30 GMT
Post by sid on Jun 14, 2005 16:50:30 GMT
Thanks Ruff, Sid asks: "Interesting reading Ruff, Could you perhaps explain the A & O bit, please?" I quote myself: "the whole inscription is a double anagram of PATER NOSTER, preceded and succeeded by the A(lpha) and O(mega)." The verticle line in heraldry is red, and the horizontal line in heraldry is blue. This could also represent the joining of the AGENS & PATIENS (Spl.?) which is AGENS = the positive (polarity), active, male source of all energy, and PATIENS = the negative (polarity), passive, female source of all energy. Not sure of the meaning of the colour purple where the two lines would meet. In sacred geometry I believe to hide the one (1=13) one requires 12. Best I can do.
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