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Post by gladiator on Jul 15, 2005 14:57:52 GMT
I have heard that in some countries the "G" is not present between the Square and Compasses. I was told there is some dispute to whether it belongs there or not. I'd be interested to hear some opinions on this subject. I realize it could stand for a number of things, so I was just wondering about why I don't see it in some places. Brother Eric
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Post by taylorsman on Jul 15, 2005 15:04:01 GMT
There should be! I absolutely refuse to wear a ring or any other Masonic Symbol if the "G" is missing from between the S&C. If so it's nothing to me but a piece cheap and nasty costume jewelry and I want no part of it. To put it bluntly, "no G, no thanks!"
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giovanni
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odi profanum vulgus, et arceo
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Post by giovanni on Jul 15, 2005 17:40:29 GMT
The letter G is variously interpreted but its meaning is, more or less, the same.
Some think that it means God; in Latin countries they think it stands for "Gnosis", i. e. the personal research for God. But either God or Gnosis the final result is always the same: Freemasonry knows no dogma, so it may mean either the final goal (God) or the path to reach it (Gnosis).
It must however be stressed that this final result cannot be reached if morality (square) and intellect (compass) are not balanced.
It is quite evident that square & compass without G are meaningless.
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phil
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Just me all at sea
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Post by phil on Jul 15, 2005 18:18:54 GMT
There is more than one or two interpretations for the letter G between the S&C.
Firstly, the letter "G" is the seventh letter of the alphabet which coincides with the seven steps to the inner chamber. Coincidence? Maybe!!
Secondly, I have always considered the letter "G" to represent Geometry or refers to the Great Geometrician of the Universe. Geometry being the noblest of the seven libral arts and sciences.
S&FG
Phil
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Post by munkholt on Jul 15, 2005 18:22:13 GMT
This is the symbol over the entrance to the grand Freemason's Hall here in Copenhagen: The simplicity fits the style of the building (and was only just recently installed), but I've seen it here in Denmark without the G so many times that it is obviously the Order's choice (whereas I can only recall having seen the Compass being at 90° in this one instance).
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giovanni
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odi profanum vulgus, et arceo
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Post by giovanni on Jul 15, 2005 18:22:53 GMT
Geometry recalls equilibrium and harmony.
Thus, G-d!
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Post by gladiator on Jul 16, 2005 1:00:22 GMT
Very interesting. Thank you. Eric
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Post by hollandr on Jul 16, 2005 4:29:10 GMT
Gladiator
Idries Shah tells us that it is not a G but an arabic Q (rotated 90 deg) and stands for the 100th and secret name of god - the lost word. But most lodges no longer use the strange shaped G but a regular G. Perhaps those are the regular lodges ;-)
Cheers
Russell
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ruffashlar
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Lodge Milncroft No. 1515 (GLoS), Govanhill Royal Arch Chapter 523 (S.G.R.A.C.S.)
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Post by ruffashlar on Jul 16, 2005 5:32:32 GMT
An Arabic Q is a Roman Q: they both come from the letter Qof in the Phoenician alphabet.
Anyway, the Roman G is just an adaptation of the Phoenician C, written very like a 7: you can see from this where the Greek Gamma is taken from, and that letter is very like a Square in shape.
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Post by taylorsman on Jul 16, 2005 6:01:30 GMT
As to what the "G" means to me, I usually say "God", (refer to the final sentence of the Second Degree Tracing Board in most English Workings), but I can certainly accept the subsidiary meanings of "Geometry" or "Gnosis" as both of these are examples to me of the Power of God.
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jmd
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Post by jmd on Jul 16, 2005 15:09:07 GMT
There are various workings and various constitutions, but would have thought that in all constitutions, there are a number of instances in which the Square and Compasses are shown without the letter G.
For example, as two of the three greater lights, placed upon the V.S.L. without the G.
In such a case, on e may of course also argue that the V.S.L. represents the letter G - but that is separate to the question as asked.
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Post by taylorsman on Jul 16, 2005 16:13:59 GMT
Nice to hear from you again Bro JMD. I had thought that was the reason for only the S&Q on the WM's Pedestal as the VSL already there and on which they are laid represented God. Also at least here in the UK the "G" is present either on the floor as in the main Temple in Brighton, suspended from the ceiling, or pendant from the Lewis on the SW's Pedestal.
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jmd
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Post by jmd on Jul 17, 2005 6:59:28 GMT
Thank you for the welcome back, dear Bro.
In our own Lodges in the masculine only consitution this part of the world, the 'G' is also suspended literally in the centre of the Lodge - it is therefore, of course, therefore not seen by the candidate as his hoodwink is removed as his eyes first see the three greater lights.
My own reflections on the letter 'G' and whether or not it should always form part of the threefold square-compass-G symbol is that though great they are together, they need not be so.
In terms of Masonry Universal, I would have thought that it is the Square and Compass that is its universal symbol, and that the 'G' remains one of those ever so important other symbol by which the craft's veiled allegories becomes illustrated.
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Post by whistler on Jul 17, 2005 19:35:11 GMT
I have read of a Degree that considers it a progression of conscience to remove the G...
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Post by gipsyrose on Jul 18, 2005 10:29:27 GMT
arabic Q Roman Q letter Q in the Phoenician alphabet. the strange shaped G lodges no longer use Could someone show me what these look like?
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Post by hollandr on Jul 18, 2005 22:18:07 GMT
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jmd
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Post by jmd on Jul 19, 2005 13:15:47 GMT
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Post by gladiator on Jul 19, 2005 13:28:39 GMT
All of your responses were very helpful and educational. Thank you. Eric
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Post by PaulS on Jul 19, 2005 16:20:22 GMT
I've just done a quick google for masonic squares (images).
A guestimate would suggest that 3/4 of the 1000+ images found had the G.
I can see a visit to the tattoo artist on the cards to get mine altered.
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Post by ecvanzyl on Jul 22, 2005 8:18:32 GMT
When it comes to jewelry with the S & C on it I always prefer the G to be present. I often do the 1st degree 'symbols' charge in which it starts:
'The symbols to which I desire to direct your attention are the 3 great lights and the three small lights of Freemasonry etc etc'
Now the three great lights are the VSL, the square and the compass. I believe, although there are many interpretations, the s & c with the 'G' in the middle represents these 3 great lights.
THe smaller lights of Freemasonry, as I understand it, may not conflict with the greater lights.
In any event having just the s & c would, on the '3 great lights' analogy, merely represent your duties towards yourself and your neighbor (square pointing with right angles to justice and duty and the compasses signifying wisdom prudence and caution in your relations with others).
So no reason I suppose why one would not be able to use it in either way.
I, as stated by someone above, also always assumed, and I stand to be corrected, that the G is represented by the VSL (thus meaning the actual letter is not there) with the S & C placed thereon.
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