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Post by taylorsman on Nov 16, 2004 10:09:15 GMT
Last night I attended an Installation and as usual heard the Installing Master state as he invests the ME with the WM's Collar that "....it is the Highest Honour the Lodge can confer on any of its members".
But in reality IS IT? In most UGLE Lodges whatever Ritual or Working is used the WM is usually there by "Buggins Turn". Very seldom is the Master Elect contested for that position. He is normally the SW of the Lodge and only one name is put up for the "Election" at the Meeting prior to the Installation, indeed Grand Lodge now advises that a Ballot can be dispensed with when only one candidate for ME is put forward. Also the WM is King for a Year only and Reigns rather than Rules, most Lodges de facto being run by the Secretary and DC and the Lodge Committee . After his year, or perhaps two, the WM is "Last Year's Model" as IPM.
In my opinion making a Brother an Honorary Member is a far greater Honour reflecting as it does the Lodge's appreciation for his work and service and not lightly bestowed and certainly not something to be expected. A Lodge can have many Past Masters but few if any Honorary Members, and here I am excluding PGMs etc who are often given that status by Lodges simply as a result of their holding the Rank they do, but am refering specifically to Ordinary Brethren who are granted that Honour.
So do you agree with my feelings, or accept the words in the book as being an accurate description of being the WM?
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Sensei
Member
Website: www.tskc.co.uk TAIRYOKU SKC
Posts: 40
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Post by Sensei on Nov 16, 2004 10:46:59 GMT
Ste - Taylorsman,
Both! I agree entirely with your view regarding Honorary membership (as long as it isn't done in the same vein i.e. after a banner dedication, making the 'team' Honorary members etc as this is done so as not to upset the 'regular flow' of what normally happens).
However, I am extremely proud to have witnessed in all my Lodges and nearly on every occasion, that committee meetings discuss and seriously consider the worthiness of the upcoming ME.
In my Chapter, H was denied the MEZ chair through ballott because of the work he did not do previously. Some say he should never of got that far, well I can tell you that there were motions not to install him as J in the first place but the general concensus was to give him the benefit of the doubt.
You do learn by your mistakes. On the whole though, many Lodges do tend to trudge along the conveyor belt procedure through fear of 'upsetting the apple cart'.
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Post by middlepillar on Nov 16, 2004 13:20:48 GMT
Taylorsman A good question to really get our teeth into! I both agree and disagree with your statement!?! Firstly if we take honorary membership, it is indeed an honour and one which my Lodge rarely confers on any of its members, the last time was two years ago and before that about 10 years ago. On both occasions definately deserved and gratiously accepted by both brethren. However I have known 2 seperate Lodges offer honorary membership to one of thier members and on these two occasions it was because in the words of both my hosts "there a bloody nuisance and if we offer them honarary membership they have not got any voting rights"! So just a little downer on what should be a great honour. Secondly, I cannot agree with you on your statement, "The WM reigns for one year but does not rule". Like Sensei I am in a London Lodge and my Lodge also takes the selection of WM very seriously, it is never muggins turn, if the SW is capable and has done his best in the years preceding he is of course the obvious choice but we have in the past suggested that the SW might like to sit another year or even go back to JW so that he might be more ready when the time comes, and this is because we expect our WM to rule over the Lodge. He has the final say in all things for his year, from the appointment of officers (including Secretary and DC) to the choice of Menu, work carried out, any social functions he might like to try and any thing else he might like to bring up for discussion. Our WM also decides what work he will do and is responsible for choosing /asking other Brethren to do any of the other ritual he does not do. He is totally in charge for one year! As it should be (IMHO Where I do agree is that on the one occasion my Lodge got it wrong (we all make mistakes!) You have to be ready to point out to the WM/ME his responsibilities, and guide or lead him through his year so that you dont have cause to regret electing him in the first place.
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Post by ingo on Nov 16, 2004 18:48:11 GMT
I do not agree either. Our lodge takes the election of e WM seriously as well. Because for our lodge the WM gives the direction for the development! Not the secretary nor the orator or the SW! It is a powerfull and reasonable position even because the GOL does not rule the lodges, the lodges are souvereign themselves to chosse the rituals, the themes which are dicussed in open lodge, in the evenings with non-masons etc. It is a very serious topic to find a new WM. Often masonry is entered by people who want to make up a career because they did not succed outside the temple. But for the German masons inside the GOL, the WM is the highest rank they can achieve. The GOs are stteled by the masons of Luxemburg themselves! Honorary membership is a honour as well. But becoming WM is much honorable (and much more work!!)
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Post by Doric on Nov 17, 2004 0:05:22 GMT
I regard being in the chair of a Lodge I joined less than 18 months ago gives value to the statement made as I was invested. No "Buggins turn" here, methinks
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Post by whistler on Nov 17, 2004 3:41:57 GMT
i am inclined to agree, it is the highest Honour the brn can confirm. OK we may only have one person to vote for - Normally the Current Master leaves his name on the Ballot paper to ensure a choice. When that doesn't happen and there is only one candidate we would use the ballot box with balls so any who felt displeasure could vote against the candidate. Please don't ask me what would happen if that Ballot proved unfavourable.. In our Lodge we do not have any honorary Members, I don't know why but we just don't. So there is no higher Rank that can be confered
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Post by billmcelligott on Nov 17, 2004 5:01:15 GMT
Honorary Memberships. Can I please warn member of the pitfalls of the Honorary sustsem in UGLE Lodges. I have been campaigning for changes in this regard for several yaers now. are you aware taht when a Freemason is made an Honorrary member all his accepted privileges cease. Unless he is a paid up member of another Lodge , he may not a) Visit another Lodge b) Take an Office c) Vote d) Recieve any promotion e) Receive any appointment f) Receive any award or Certificate Most Masons have no idea that this is a consequence of their vote, many carry on regardless not knowing. www.essex-lodges.org/files/craft/honmemb.rtf
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Post by Doric on Nov 17, 2004 7:24:01 GMT
Bill The situation isn't quite as serious as that. Although he can't vote on any Proposition, he can still Rule 167 BoC He can visit other Lodges, but unless subscribing elsewhere, he may only visit each Lodge once. You are right, it is not necessarily a good move. We wanted to confer Hon Membership on our Tyler, but it would have meant we'd have lost his services . Bloody daft rule if you ask me.
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Post by Jumile on Nov 17, 2004 14:08:43 GMT
So do you agree with my feelings, or accept the words in the book as being an accurate description of being the WM? I see your point, but at the risk of sounding twee - and terribly naive - I would think the greatest single honour that can be conferred is that of Entered Apprentice. Anything else is surely an increment of that?
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Post by billmcelligott on Nov 17, 2004 21:59:45 GMT
What started me off on this crusade was a very wonderful Mason in my Lodge, completed his 60th Year in Freemasonry about 2 years ago.
I reminded the APGM about 4 times that his 60 year certificate was due on such and such date. We arranged a special evening, gifts etc. and awaited the APGM to arrive with this certificate.
We were then told because we had voted him an Honorary member about 18 months before the 60th date, he was not going to get one. This information arrived about 2 weeks before the meeting.
OK , I know people make mistakes , Clerical errors but this was about to see an entire Lodge resign on block. This guy is now 87, still attands LOI.
This because he is seen as not a subscibing member therefore was not active in his sixtieth year.
After a couple of articles in the local Masonic Mag, which never was mentioned. Grand Lodge decided to present this wonderful , unselfish man with his 60 years Certificate. Belatedly, but the rule is still there.
I would like to see the rule changed.
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Post by middlepillar on Nov 17, 2004 22:22:57 GMT
Bill
I do agree with you that yet again Grand Lodge don't seem able to get off thier prevarbials and sort a simple problem out.
Why dont they just look at your signature!
Tolerance is the key, and we cant all be smart but when someone is lets listen to him!
PS. Bill it is a worthy crusade, although I still state honarary membership is a good tool to get rid of a nuisance!
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Sensei
Member
Website: www.tskc.co.uk TAIRYOKU SKC
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Post by Sensei on Nov 17, 2004 23:02:56 GMT
Can we not forget that the conferall (if that word exists) is NOT restricted to members of the Lodge and therefore the mere fact that 'somebody' is made an Honorary member, may well belittle the above remark. So I suppose, I must now say that becoming WM is much more an honour conferred than that of Honorary membership, IMHO. - for now anyway!!
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Post by taylorsman on Nov 18, 2004 6:44:33 GMT
Yes, I have long felt that the to me petty and spiteful removal of other Masonic capabilities such as the to me most important one of Visitation by confering Honorary Membership on a Brother of a Lodge ought to be abolished. It's down to money again, surprise, surprise. Now why not simply have the Lodge pay the UGLE Capitation Fee as is has to do for other Ordinary members but in this case NOT recoup it from the Brother in Question. This is already done for Secretaries and Tylers who get free membership in exchange for their duties. Thus UGLE gets its cash and the Brother gets the Honour from his Lodge but loses nothing by so doing.
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Post by Doric on Nov 18, 2004 7:05:08 GMT
This is already done for Secretaries and Tylers who get free membership in exchange for their duties. Where did you get the idea that Tylers get free membership? Rule 104(c) Boc states but I can't find any similar rule for Tylers
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Post by billmcelligott on Nov 18, 2004 14:04:42 GMT
I always thought Tylers just got paid i think my two Lodges pay about £ 30 plus meal.
Cant wait till I retire get some dosh.
My proposal on honorary Members is that Grand Lodge allows us to adopt the Scottish tradition , of paying a one of Fee to maintain membership of a Mother Lodge for the rest of the Honorary Members life. Lets say it is £ 300 . Its a gamble he might drop down , brown bread in a week. or he might go on for another 30 years. My members would have gladly paid such a sum to maintain the status of our Honorary Member.
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Post by offramp on Nov 18, 2004 16:11:15 GMT
Where stands the Lodge Organist as regards payment?
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Post by Doric on Nov 18, 2004 17:43:43 GMT
If the Organist is not a member, he can be paid, usually around £15 plus dinner in the Provinces. Going rate for Tylers in my part of the world is £15 plus dinner & tips
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Sensei
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Website: www.tskc.co.uk TAIRYOKU SKC
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Post by Sensei on Nov 19, 2004 1:23:14 GMT
Tips!!! Why don't I get "tips" as DC for doing my job! I don't even get paid let alone "tips"!!!! Maybe I should offer my services for a reasonable rate (PLUS dinner of course :-))
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Post by Doric on Nov 19, 2004 6:53:03 GMT
Tips!!! Why don't I get "tips" as DC for doing my job! I don't even get paid let alone "tips"!!!! Maybe I should offer my services for a reasonable rate (PLUS dinner of course :-)) Because you don't have to turn up an hour earlier that the rest, and prepare the Lodge so that some DC can check it afterwards, and sit outside reassuring nervous Candidates. You don't have to know where the heating controls are, nor advise the Caterer at the last minute that the meeting is running late, oh and by the way, there are another 3 people dining, one a veggie. And you don't have to be the last to leave, and lock up after everyone else. That's why you don't get tips! ;D
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Post by taylorsman on Nov 19, 2004 7:14:17 GMT
Doric, as Member of the Lodge I do NOT get paid, but have to say that the going rate for a paid Tyler in London is far higher than in the Midlands. Some are getting at least £30 per Meeting some get more plus a meal, £20 to £25 worth in London and wine.
I agree its a lot of additional work, just like that of the Secretary, most of which is unseen by the Ordinary Members.
I must say I have never yet seen a Tyler, or any other Lodge Officer being "tipped" by individual Members and would NOT like such a custom myself, is this a Midlands practice then? I HAVE seen waitresses tipped at the Festive Board, but only in Sussex, not elsewhere.
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