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Post by mattjtayl on May 2, 2008 12:36:25 GMT
I have heard that the lodge secretary is a very tough job that no one wants. Usually a guy gets stuck being secretary for many years and the members have no idea the kind of work involved with that office, even the Past Masters.
Our lodge secretary has been feeling the weight. The amount of paperwork is enormous! If things are not sent in on time grand lodge can impose stiff penalties including taking away a lodge's charter.
Our present sitting master told us it is a thankless job that is not appreciated much. He was a secretary for 7 years at another lodge. Many past masters have no idea the kind of work involved with it and the secretary often does a lot of work without the thanks he deserves.
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Post by leonardo on May 2, 2008 14:14:18 GMT
It's unfortunate you seem to be experiencing little positive in your Masonic life at present and hopefully this trend will cease and you'll soon start enjoying more uplifting times.
I must say I am surprised your PMs have little understanding of what a Secretary has to do, or your sitting RWM would say, "it is a thankless job that is not appreciated much."
Our Lodge Secretary is highly respected and very much appreciated for all she does.
As I say, you seem unfortunate.
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Post by penfold on May 2, 2008 16:18:39 GMT
Matty I have to agree with Leo, most of the posts you have made here are negative, if you are finding so much of your experience negative why do you remain a member?
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Post by lauderdale on May 2, 2008 17:53:27 GMT
I have been a Lodge Secretary in an UGLE Lodge and am now one in an LDH Lodge. There are similarities but differences too. In LDH I do not have to be bothered about Catering etc as we tend to have a bring and share buffet rather than a sit down meal as our FB.
It is one of those "Boiler House" jobs so to speak, much of the work is done behind the scenes, the same goes for a Lodge Treasurer. The Master, Wardens and Deacons and the DC tend to get the plaudits if all goes well, but a good Secretary can ensure that all the arrangements fit together. In my other two Lodges I am glad to say we have a first class Secretary who ensures all runs smoothly.
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Post by corab on May 2, 2008 20:55:39 GMT
I am the Secretary of two Craft lodges, one project group and one administrative body in my Federation, and I can tell you it is far from thankless.
It's a lot of hard work, but it's very rewarding because in the end you know you make a major contribution to the proper running of the lodge.
There's no glory in it -- but then again that's not what freemasonry is about, right?
I wish people would realise the importance of proper craft administration.
Look at it this way: there's the Body Freemasonry -- the organisation -- and there's the Spirit Freemasonry -- that which under the auspices of the organisation we study and practice. The Spirit can't survive without the Body.
These two pillars, Form and Force; "To E*s" and "In S*h" form the solid, stable foundation upon which greater things are founded. That whole structure will founder if the two pillars are not in balance; if the stresses of the structure are not evenly distributed over the two pillars.
A thankless job? Think again.
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Post by droche on May 2, 2008 23:56:21 GMT
It certainly is not an easy job, but in most lodges with which I am familiar, the Secretary is also one of the most respected if not the most respected member of the Lodge. Thus, one can look at the glass as being either half empty or half full.
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imakegarb
Member
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Post by imakegarb on May 3, 2008 2:52:10 GMT
I've had a chance to see just what our secretary does. (blink-blink)My head would explode
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Post by mattjtayl on May 3, 2008 3:12:30 GMT
Matty I have to agree with Leo, most of the posts you have made here are negative, if you are finding so much of your experience negative why do you remain a member? Do I sound negative? I don't mean to come off that way at all, its quite the contrary. I love the masons very much the last couple years I have been in it. I wouldn't have joined the Scottish Rite and York Rite otherwise. I will be either SD or JD next year depending. All my lodge members say I am on my way to be a future worshipful, so that would be great if I could stay active that long. No I meant it when I took my Oath I am in this for life I can be negative without realizing it, thats just my personality. I am that way about everything in my life. I don't interpet it that way, but others do. I just am critical. I am that way about my job, my family, everything around me. Don't take any offense by it brother, this is just my personality. No I have been trying to learn everything I possibly can about the masons everyday. I have been regulary studying the bible and discussing with lodge members where parts of the ritual come out of the bible. Masonry has made me understand the bible a lot better. This summer our lodge members are all going to go to church together on one sunday morning. I have a long long bloodline of masons in my family that traces all the way back to my ancestors from England & Germany. Over 200 some years of masons in my family. I would rather cut off my right arm then give up masonry. I love it more and more every day.
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Post by leonardo on May 3, 2008 6:58:28 GMT
That's good to know, but it's interesting that in your lengthy post (above) you have not once responded to what any have said with regard to your supposition that being a Lodge Secretary is a "thankless job,"
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Post by mattjtayl on May 3, 2008 9:49:21 GMT
That's good to know, but it's interesting that in your lengthy post (above) you have not once responded to what any have said with regard to your supposition that being a Lodge Secretary is a "thankless job," Ok my appologies brother Leo. I do find that very interesting that other lodges seem to know a great deal about what the secretary does. So it must be just in my area then. Thats noteworthy to note.
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Post by billmcelligott on May 3, 2008 10:47:00 GMT
It seemed a reasonable question to me.
I will have to agree, being Secretary can be a thankless job. The Secretary gets taken for granted by the rest of the Lodge, I think it is safe to say.
So long as everything works then no one other than a 'past Sec' gives the effort a second thought. It is when things do not go right everyone glares at the Secretary, assuming he has second sight and should have predicted the problem.
Dining is always the big silly job, each member attends the GP and promises faithfully to tell when they will or will not attend. Out of 48 members maybe 6 or 7 will call and say they are dining, none ever phone to say they will not be attending. So I guess at how many I book for dining, I have been guessing so long I am never more than 2 out.
I am Sec at the moment in both Lodge and Royal Arch, [done the job before - second time]so I am entitled to moan. But after moaning, I have to admit I quite like the job, the good thing is you are at the centre of everything, I have to be honest and say I like being involved with all that happens in my Lodge.
On the other side of the this is, no one makes you do the job. There is no armed guard that comes round each year and forces you into the job. so there is always a choice.
What I will say is it takes time to get the job working well, you have to establish a pattern of works and that will probably take a year, then the second year to put right the mistakes from the first year. So maybe by the 3rd year you start to get things right. I think it should be a 5 year post, then move over to let someone else have a go.
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Post by Mikepm on May 3, 2008 11:16:08 GMT
Matty I have to agree with Leo, most of the posts you have made here are negative, if you are finding so much of your experience negative why do you remain a member? I'm a Secretary for one of my craft Lodges, and Scribe E (Secretary) in Chapter. It can be difficult when first taking over, but it is a nice job once you get into it, and there is software that you can purchase which will be a great asset if you purchase it, it's called, The Lodge Secretary. This has been a great asset to me. It saves you so much time. The reason i have used Penfolds quote, is i feel that this can be the type of comment that puts people off from remaining in Freemasonry. Matt has made a comment about the Secretarys role, and a more positive response would have been more appropriate. We need to encourage the bretheren and make it more fun and enjoyable, not start to question why we are still members. No wonder lodges are struggling to keep members!! Regards Mike.
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Post by droche on May 3, 2008 13:14:55 GMT
It seemed a reasonable question to me. I will have to agree, being Secretary can be a thankless job. The Secretary gets taken for granted by the rest of the Lodge, I think it is safe to say. So long as everything works then no one other than a 'past Sec' gives the effort a second thought. It is when things do not go right everyone glares at the Secretary, assuming he has second sight and should have predicted the problem. Dining is always the big silly job, each member attends the GP and promises faithfully to tell when they will or will not attend. Out of 48 members maybe 6 or 7 will call and say they are dining, none ever phone to say they will not be attending. So I guess at how many I book for dining, I have been guessing so long I am never more than 2 out. I am Sec at the moment in both Lodge and Royal Arch, [done the job before - second time]so I am entitled to moan. But after moaning, I have to admit I quite like the job, the good thing is you are at the centre of everything, I have to be honest and say I like being involved with all that happens in my Lodge. On the other side of the this is, no one makes you do the job. There is no armed guard that comes round each year and forces you into the job. so there is always a choice. What I will say is it takes time to get the job working well, you have to establish a pattern of works and that will probably take a year, then the second year to put right the mistakes from the first year. So maybe by the 3rd year you start to get things right. I think it should be a 5 year post, then move over to let someone else have a go. Very good insights, but I would only wonder about your view on a "term limit," so to speak, of five years on the position. Especially in some of the larger lodges, it would seem to me that it could take that long for the average person to become comfortable with all that needs to be done and then it would start all over again. In any event, the average time of a secretary's tenure over the entire organization is perhaps but five years, so perhaps my point is moot.
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Post by billmcelligott on May 3, 2008 14:13:00 GMT
Well that is a double edged sword, if the Lodge is say 75 plus, you will have a lot of people waiting around doing nothing for some years.
I would suggest 5 to 7 years but have an assistant sec. Its up to the Lodge, but I take the point, there is a lot to learn.
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Post by leonardo on May 3, 2008 15:40:09 GMT
As we bring our own grub our Secretary simply deals in the admin side of things. If she had to organise full FBs, á la UGLE style, then it might be a different story, but as she's extremely efficient I don't see her having any difficulty
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Post by waynecowley on May 3, 2008 16:00:27 GMT
Round here the Secretary rarely organises the Dining for the FB - that is usually down to the Catering Steward (me in the case of our Mark Lodge) and I can testify that Bill is right. I suspect I will spend a fair bit of time this weekend ringing round our members to see who is coming next Thursday (something they should have rang me to advise me of by last Thursday!)
Wayne
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Post by droche on May 3, 2008 16:09:39 GMT
Well that is a double edged sword, if the Lodge is say 75 plus, you will have a lot of people waiting around doing nothing for some years. I would suggest 5 to 7 years but have an assistant sec. Its up to the Lodge, but I take the point, there is a lot to learn. Yes, I think an Assistant Secretary in the larger lodges is an excellent idea. It relieves some burden from the Secretary and in the event of sudden incapacitation of the Secretary, there is someone there to keep things going smoothly. I have seen some lodges with an Assistant Secretary and it seems to work out well.
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Post by penfold on May 3, 2008 18:44:05 GMT
Mike, maybe you need to browse thru his other posts before jumping to conclusions bro?
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Post by AndyF on May 5, 2008 1:22:56 GMT
In my Lodge, (and all others in our jurisdiction as far as I am aware) the JW arranges the festive board, and the Stewards make it happen. Of course our JW does more than just plan the meal and then abandon the Stewards to figure it out and do all the work lol.
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Post by maat on May 5, 2008 3:29:12 GMT
I have been "stuck" with a job for quite some years now, one I have little time for, seeing I still work full time and have other pressing responsibilities. I don't do it for love or thanks, I do it because everyone else says they can't or won't do it.
For this reason alone I think that all positions should have a 'pass the baton' date. Who knows what they can do until they try. Who as an EA thought they would have the skills to be a successful Master.
Long term tenure in jobs can also promote despotism/inflated egos/martyr complexes ... not good for Brns health
Maat
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