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Post by a on Mar 25, 2005 8:07:02 GMT
Did not the Spaniards destroy the Mayan Culture and impose Roman Catholicism on them by the Sword as they did for other parts of what is now Central and South America? No matter how much brute force is used, knowledge and truth, will always find a way to reilluminate. Maat has a balance which will always be found. Just now, at this precise point in time, is just one of those times that balance is being restored.
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Mar 25, 2005 8:20:18 GMT
However, as comparative anthropolgists are wont to indicate, the Mayan and Conquistador cultures shared exactly the same values: God, Man, Redemption and Blood.
The Mayans believed Man must Redeem the Gods through the Blood of other Men. The Conquistadors believed God had already Redeemed Man with the Blood of a Man who was also a God.
Insofar as all primitive cultures resemble one another superficially, and all share the same basic anxieties - the preciousness and fragility of life, the looming unknown of mortality, recurrently-themed myth cycles, and the brutal struggle for survival itself - it is curious how, from essentially identical origins, two cultures should have arrived at so very different sets of cultural values over the course of, say, ten thousand years. Ten thousand years of the human mind applying itself to the marginally different problems of existence either side of one ocean, and yet both arrive at essentially the same solution to all of life's problems: human sacrifice, whether figurative or starkly literal. The process is not dissimilar to the organic construction of a psychosis; it is merely shared by more than the usual one person.
So, it is hardly to be wondered that the Mayan calendar seems to foretell a literal end, the world and time breaking off suddenly amid immense catastrophes. Our own culture has foretold substantially the same fate, albeit couched in the minority cult of Millennarian apocalyptic utterances. As before, our culture is figurative in its methodology: metaphorical, symbolic. We do not literally believe disaster to be upon us, we express the cultural unease in elaborate mimes and pseudo-ideas, fictive realities of imagined destruction: computer games, books and cinema are the poetic medium of our Ragnarok.
Whereas the Mayan is frankly mathematical: existence divided by itself produces zero. Their psychosis, not ours.
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Post by Hubert (N. Z.) on Mar 26, 2005 1:12:36 GMT
I find it interesting that we are presently experiencing an Islamic Fundamentalism, similar to the "Christian Crusades" of the 1100s. History want's to repeat itself, but at anothers expense.
Blood sacrifce of old has merely shifted from one religion to another. As in all ages the enlightened move on, and keep their knowledge secret, as those ignorant of it's merits seek only to destroy that which they cannot comprehend.
Freemasonry has no blood sacrifce for the enlightened need no such wierd menances.
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Post by whistler on Mar 26, 2005 2:13:08 GMT
In the cycle of things - immense knowledge seems to peak and the vanish for a while, as with the Mayans, the Atlantians, The arcane Knowledge of the Egyptians until the Ptolemies violated the sanctuaries, The wisdom of Tibet, Great Zimbabwe, the Inca's - What wisdom vanished with the Libraries in Alexandra. Do we ever regain all the wisdom that is lost each time?
It all reminds me of the hidden wisdoms of Freemasonry which is like a sea serpent, at times part is visable and then it vanishes to reemerge at another time another place
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jmd
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Post by jmd on Mar 26, 2005 4:26:52 GMT
The 'why' of that date was, I thought, worked out by those interested in studying that branch of astronomy/astrology/calendar making, as indicating the conjunction of some important (and to the Mayans, symbolically significant) astronomical events.
If one takes the ecliptic and the line along the Milky Way (the Galactic 'equator'), then, due to the precession of the equinox, and their important dating of rebirth at the Winter Solstice, it was noted that a conjunction would occur in so many years' time.
Given that close observations of various stellar movements were carefully worked out, and given the importance of both the dark patches (also important here in many Aboriginal myth cycles, by the way) and the Milky Way, to note that the Sun motion (or rather, the Ecliptic) was slowly moving towards not only the Galactic equator (the Milky Way) but also, incredibly, towards a black patch - a hole - meant that a calendar could be built up towards such end.
What would become of Earth once the Sun plummetted through the chasm?
Possibly the same as happened when the Conquestadors butchered so many South and Central Americans who likewise believed that their calendar had indicated such an end.
The end of a calendar is not the end of humanity - only the end of a calendar.
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Post by stephenorsillo on Mar 27, 2005 15:58:34 GMT
maybe, just maybe we can look at those predictions to remind ourselves of how limited and fragile our lives really are and make the most of what we have right here and now as none of it may be here tomorrow.
Be Seeing You!
S
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Mar 28, 2005 2:59:33 GMT
like a sea serpent, at times part is visable and then it vanishes to reemerge at another time another place
Indeed, or as I prefer to view the issue, like the Loch Ness Monster, a series of humps maintained above the waterline of credibility by completely artificial means, the helium of self-delusion.
There is in truth little lost knowledge anymore. What knowledge the Classical world had we have substantially recovered. what is lost, and irrecoverable, are the richness of unbroken tradition, and the subtleties of a vanished civilisation, the vast phantoms of which never cease to haunt us. Some monstrous apparitions, truly, come unbidden.
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Post by whistler on Mar 29, 2005 1:26:03 GMT
There is in truth little lost knowledge anymore. What knowledge the Classical world had we have substantially recovered. what is lost, and irrecoverable, are the richness of unbroken tradition, and the subtleties of a vanished civilisation, the vast phantoms of which never cease to haunt us. Some monstrous apparitions, truly, come unbidden.[/1]Ruff I love the above it is so unbelievably arrogant to presume to know most of what there is to know. “There is in truth little lost knowledge anymore”<br> Just one example “ Everyone knows that the Tibetan masters can levitate and fly. Marco Polo, the first Westerner to formally record an encounter with the Tibetan lamas, reported witnessing the phenomenon over seven hundred years ago (and Italians never lie). The modern adventurer Madame Alexander David Neil also wrote of her sightings of lamas on the wing (and, again, the French never exaggerate). Traditional Tibetan literature similarly tells of Buddhist mystics who have taken off in joyful flight. Buddha himself is said to have done so on several occasions, as did Indian masters such as Nagarjuna and Padma Sambhava. The legacy was adopted by Tibetan mystics in the eighth century, with the yogini Yeshey Tsogyal as a prime example, and continued over the centuries. The eleventh century yogi and poet Milarepa is another famous flyer.The historical anecdotes in Tibetan literature and oral tradition that speak of mystics with powers of levitation and flight find their way into Tibetan art. . Levitation is not unique to Tibetans –<br> Just because we may not know how doesn’t mean it couldn’t be done –<br>How to levitate is lost knowledge ;D
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Mar 29, 2005 6:42:38 GMT
"it is so unbelievably arrogant to presume to know most of what there is to know"
I only claimed that we now know most of what once was known. Unlike Charlemagne, we no longer believe that Alexander the Great once possessed the ability to travel through the air, suspended on the talons of winged griffins. We are rather more like Roger Bacon, who did not know all that the Ancients knew, but at least knew the limits of Classical learning. Levitation he considered to be a scientific advance of the future.
Assuming it is true that the Buddha, along with St Francis, St Brendan, St Bernard and Robert-Houdin, not to mention the Natural Law Party and those Tibetan Master chappies, all have levitated at some time (which I'm perfectly prepared to admit may have happened - just that I don't personally believe it), then this constitutes knowledge which is not lost.
Truly lost knowledge, such as how the Moei were moved into position, or how the Chinese built their Rainbow Bridges, is capable of being recovered by asking what effects these inventions are known to have produced, and creating a solution to fit those criteria.
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Post by taylorsman on Mar 29, 2005 8:52:51 GMT
Even in the purely physical plane it is dangerous to state that "we now know it all". It was once held that the Atom was completely solid. We now know this to be a false and there are many sub atomic particles, and there are multitudes of situations when an accepted "truth" has been proven to be wrong, e.g. exceeding the Speed of Sound without killing the travellers.
Can people "levitate"?. I have't seen it myself, but I have read many accounts of it in ancient times and even as Ruff mentions the "Yogic Flying" of the Natural Law Party, and do not reject it out of hand, though personally I would expect it to be achieved by some highy technological and mechanical manner probably requiring a great deal of physical energy to overcome gravity.
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Mar 29, 2005 9:42:41 GMT
"some highy technological and mechanical manner probably requiring a great deal of physical energy to overcome gravity"
The deus ex machina of Greek drama: a god being winched down on a piece of stage machinery.
The relative weight of Disbelief has grown exponentially in recent centuries. However, this only seems to apply to the kinds of things which those in former times seemed capable of believing in effortlessly, such as God, the Divine Right of Kings, Mom's Apple Pie and Common Human Decency. Levitation and Witchcraft, which were absorbed enthusiastically at different times in some areas, but which always required some considerable effort either to get people to believe or, once their political expediency was over, to stop them believing in them, are apparently immune to this historical variety of seasonal adjustment.
It caused some wit, either Spike Milligan or Spike Lee, (or possibly Bruce Lee), to opine, "Those who don't believe in God will believe anything else."
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Post by a on Mar 29, 2005 9:52:17 GMT
I would expect it to be achieved by some highy technological and mechanical manner probably requiring a great deal of physical energy to overcome gravity. I can't do it, but I would imagine that it is much simpler than that, as are most of the laws of nature. I think that you will find that Franz Bardon's Initiation into Hermetics (available form another forum shops esoteric section) will give you a step by step guide to such things.
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Mar 30, 2005 20:39:36 GMT
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