staffs
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Staffs
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IPM
Jan 16, 2005 16:23:24 GMT
Post by staffs on Jan 16, 2005 16:23:24 GMT
I have had may a converstaion with our IPM last year and he aslo stated that you feel left out and not wanted. This year though he has nothing to do and does not even have an office so he will feel even more left out. He ghas joined KT as something new and enjoys this order very much.
However the DC has this year managed to get the IPM to run the festive board which appartently always used to be the case so the IPM this year is going to be a busy boy and the DC gets to relax and enjoy his meal and guests at the FB and not worry if he has one too many glasses of wine.
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IPM
Jan 16, 2005 16:54:53 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jan 16, 2005 16:54:53 GMT
A good idea Lee if the IPM in question is good at that sort of thing. One has to match horses for courses. A poor organiser would be a bad Secretary, a mumbler with a monotone voice would not do justice to the Office of Chaplain . I would be useless if involved with anything to do with Social Events , Ladies Nights, etc as I am just not interested in such matters and don't attend them.
I wonder how many PMs do lose interest after they have done their year as IPM and then there is nothing for them to do in that Lodge. Do they simply fade away, missing Meetings, paying a sub but not attending very often, resigning in good standing but not joining any other Lodges. Does anyone follow up and try to find out why the have lost interest and if so find something for them to do?
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IPM
Jan 16, 2005 17:35:29 GMT
Post by Trinityman on Jan 16, 2005 17:35:29 GMT
I remember reading some statistic somewhere that After the Chair is the second biggest drop-out flashpoint after attaining MM apron. Unfortunately I can't remember where I read it . I don't think it's a major problem but certainly worth keeping an eye on in our respective lodges.
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staffs
Administrator
Staffs
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IPM
Jan 16, 2005 17:41:06 GMT
Post by staffs on Jan 16, 2005 17:41:06 GMT
SO
after all this lovely chat...... IS the IPM an officer of the lodge ??
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IPM
Jan 16, 2005 17:48:25 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jan 16, 2005 17:48:25 GMT
NO!
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 0:45:15 GMT
Post by Doric on Jan 17, 2005 0:45:15 GMT
Unless, of course, in the case of one of my Lodges, where the IPM will also serve as Secretary, and in my own case, when I served as Assistant Secretry during my year as IPM (Oh, and DC as well!)
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 6:51:34 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jan 17, 2005 6:51:34 GMT
Yes, but then the Brother is an Officer as Secretary, Assistant Secretary, DC or whatever, but NOT as IPM which I think most are agreed is NOT an "Officer of the Lodge".
I would also assume that if a man does his year as WM, then he becomes IPM but for some reason cannot attend the Lodge for the next year he is still IPM and any PM filling that position as a stop gap is NOT per se, the IPM but a PM discharging the duties of arranging the S&C on the VSL, prompting the WM if needed etc.
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 7:55:24 GMT
Post by Doric on Jan 17, 2005 7:55:24 GMT
Yes, but then the Brother is an Officer as Secretary, Assistant Secretary, DC or whatever, but NOT as IPM which I think most are agreed is NOT an "Officer of the Lodge". I would also assume that if a man does his year as WM, then he becomes IPM but for some reason cannot attend the Lodge for the next year he is still IPM and any PM filling that position as a stop gap is NOT per se, the IPM but a PM discharging the duties of arranging the S&C on the VSL, prompting the WM if needed etc. And in that case the WM should not ask a PM to "Act as IPM for the evening", but to "perform the duties of the IPM"
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:06:11 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jan 17, 2005 8:06:11 GMT
For once we agree, Doric! It would be more correct, but I doubt that they would say it that way but fall back on the more usual request, albeit wrong.
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:13:31 GMT
Post by Doric on Jan 17, 2005 8:13:31 GMT
At least there are 2 PM's in the English Constitution using the correct protocols, namely thee & mee
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staffs
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Staffs
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:24:54 GMT
Post by staffs on Jan 17, 2005 8:24:54 GMT
So in the inner workings which i would no nothing about,is the IPM invested or presented with his collar ??
Or have i missed something ?
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:25:38 GMT
Post by waynecowley on Jan 17, 2005 8:25:38 GMT
I was fortunate to visiy an installed masters lodge who carry out raising and passing of other lodges and at the installation the PGM forgot his words and ws prompted by most of the past masters present .approx 250 !!!!! Goes to show everyone is normal I saw something similar a few months ago when our brand new Asst PGM (on only his second outing in that capacity) forgot the words of the Address to the newly Installed Master and required a prompt. It was all the more amusing as, for the previous 5 years he had been the Provincial DC and responsible for giving those prompts himself. He did, however, turn it into a joke at his own expense at the FB Seriously, after the year as IPM some PMs are left high and dry. I like the practice of some Lodges of having the Office of Tyler reserved for the the IPM when his year as such is over. As do I. In many lodges in this area the progression often goes WM, Asst DC, Tyler In one lodge I visit they have taken it a step further and added Mentor to the list Wayne
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staffs
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Staffs
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:31:28 GMT
Post by staffs on Jan 17, 2005 8:31:28 GMT
Wayne,i like the idea of mentor whereby he can go out with the younger brethren when requyired and answer any questions that they may have. He will certainly feel useful in that capacity and will not feel left out.
My Mentors are on this Forum and who give me a great deal of advice andf assistance.
I look to Steve And Middlepillar with utmost respect and they are always there to help out.
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:33:25 GMT
Post by Hubert (N. Z.) on Jan 17, 2005 8:33:25 GMT
Strange that many of you state once beyond the IPM, these fellows tend to drop out.
Just as we need Brn in the Columns, to form a Lodge, we also need the Strength and Experince of those Past Masters in the East to Channel their/Its' Energy back to the Pavement Etc.,
We frequently need to place our PM into positions within the Lodge when juniors are short of supply.
Those that sit in the East with no Official Office, frequently are called upon to "Fill IN" should an Officer be sick, OR provide a piece of Architecture to complete a programme, or even assist in some of the Charges during the various Initiations.
By their very status, they add to the Etheric Essence of Lodge workings and are every bit essential as all Officers & Columns.
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 8:36:41 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jan 17, 2005 8:36:41 GMT
There is nothing secret in this, so here goes from Taylor's Working:-
"W Bro XY it gives me great pleasure to invest you with the Collar and Jewel of the Imediate Past Master of the Lodge. It is not within my authority as WM to confer this Office upon you, it being yours of right, you having faithfully discharged the duties of Master of the Lodge....."
Hope this helps, Lee.
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staffs
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Staffs
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 18:37:50 GMT
Post by staffs on Jan 17, 2005 18:37:50 GMT
Steve,thanks for that.
Now when i reopen my discussion i can just here it "youre not supposed to know that "
But at least i was right.
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 19:40:10 GMT
Post by taylorsman on Jan 17, 2005 19:40:10 GMT
Lee, the only parts of the Inner Workings I would NOT tell you are the Signs, Grip and Word. As with all the many Degrees and Orders I am in I am sworn not to reveal these, but I'm sure you can find them out for the Internet if you wish to.
What I have imparted is in any event printed in some of the Ritual Books as the M.E. will need to learn this as his first task when he is Installed is to Present the IPM with his Collar and its appendant Jewel using the words I have already posted or a close equivalent thereof.
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staffs
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Staffs
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 19:44:21 GMT
Post by staffs on Jan 17, 2005 19:44:21 GMT
Steve,i know im keen but i have no desire whatsoever to find out the pass grips and words of ANY degree or ritual that i have not taken.
I thank you once again for your help and valued assistance and feel honoured that you are willing to share your knowledge and to help us understand what we did not know or unsure of.
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IPM
Jan 17, 2005 22:36:27 GMT
Post by Late Knight Chemist on Jan 17, 2005 22:36:27 GMT
Steve, Your Taylor workings have a slightly longer rubric than Emulation. Not bad The Emulation format would be improved if were written as two sentences. Lee, I haven't checked but I thought the I had posted the Emulation wording a few days back. Although Taylors appears to use the word "Office" it is not an actual office. IPM is merely a descriptive title meaning newest PM of the Lodge. The IPM is invested within the inner workings. I presume that means that when he re-admits the MMs, FCs and EAs his new status, shown by his collar, will be clear for all to see.
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