co-masonry or female only?

[Deleted]

I am getting close to graduation and lately I have been thinking about what be the best group for me between co-masonic lodge and female only lodge.

I have never taken the idea of joining a female lodge seriously until now because I like co-masonic groups. But I have thinking about it and I think a female only lodge might be good for me.

I would like to know what are differences between the two groups? What are their strengths and weakness? How did you know that this group (co-masonic or female lodge) was what you wanted for masonic journey?

[peteprint1]

Hello Lynn,

I am a member of a mixed lodge in the George Washington Union, but I have had the pleasure of visiting an all women's lodge several times that belongs to the Women's Grand Lodge of Belgium.

There is no difference between our obediences in terms of the work. We both open and close the same way, work the AASR craft degrees, etc.

It really is just a matter of personal preference. Some Sisters prefer an all female environment, though of course the women's lodges that I know of all accept male visitors.

The only all female obedience that I am aware of in the U.S. is the Women's Grand Lodge of Belgium, which has lodges in Los Angeles,New York, and Washington D.C. There might be others that I don't know of though.

Hope this helped with your decision process.

Peter

[sofiadianagabel]

Hi, Lynn,

I belong to Le Droit Humain, co-Masonic. I have also visited the Grand Lodge of Belgium in Los Angeles and find their all-female lodge beautiful. For me, I personally like having men and women sharing their energies in the lodge, but it really is a personal preference. I would say that if you're more comfortable around women, an all-woman lodge would probably be for you.

[Deleted]

Thanks for your opinions you guys.
I can see your point, that it is a personal preference.
But, what I mean by difference is, I've read that for example Le Droit Humain is very theosophical and co-masonic groups focus a lot on esoteric thought. They also can be very spiritual and like to explore the mysteries of freemasonry. I have not heard to much about female lodges but I am getting the impression that they are very similar to male lodges meaning they are more socially active and focus more on the mysteries of freemasonry and ritual. But they are not as spiritual and focus somewhat on esoteric thought.

[peteprint1]

Hello again Lynn,

From my experience LDH is often Theosophically inclined, especially the British Federation, and particularly the Eastern Order. Much of this is the result of the influence of Besant, Leadbeater, and several others. The Women's Grand Lodge of Belgium, the Feminine Grand Lodge of France, my own obedience, the George Washington Union, all are closer to the Grand Orient of France in being very secular and less interested in esotericism.

It is a matter of personal preference again. For myself (and many that I know in GWU), the use of incense, white clothing, and esoteric rituals like the dharma (or Lauderdale) is not our cup of tea. We stress personal development (through the use of Masonic symbolism), and are interested in social and political issues. An individual's religious or spiritual interests are personal and largely left outside the lodge.

[Deleted]

peteprint1, thanks for answering but here's another question. I know for sure that American co-masonry and the eastern order require a belief in supreme being. But do Le Droit Humain, GWU, and women lodge require a belief in supreme being.

[peteprint1]

Hi Lynn,

No they do not. Like the Grand Orient of France, a person's religious beliefs are not an issue when it comes to joining. It is a non-issue.

This is from the South African Federation of LDH website: (http://www.droit-humain.org/southafrica/faqs.html)


"Affirmation of a belief in a Supreme Being is not a requirement for membership of Lodges within Le Droit Humain. However Lodges in the South African Federation ritually work to the Glory of the Great Architect (our term used for the creative principle or whatever one's understanding of it may be) and the Perfection of Humanity. Co-Freemasonry in South Africa maintains one or more open Volumes of Sacred Lore (could be the Bible, the Koran, the Baghavad Gita, etc) in every Lodge when duly formed for Masonic purposes. However there are Lodges in other Co-Masonic Federations that work only to the Perfection of Humanity."


LDH in the UK does require belief in the GAOTU as a creative principle:
(http://www.droit-humain.org/uk/html/principles.html)

"Co-Freemasonry within the British Federation asserts, in accordance with the ancient declarations of Freemasonry, the existence of a Creative Principle, under the title of "The Great Architect of the Universe". It maintains the open "Volume of the Sacred Lore" in every Lodge when duly formed for Masonic purposes. It maintains the ancient landmarks of Freemasonry, and withholds recognition from all irregular and clandestine meetings, or Lodges not holding proper Charter. "

As I mentioned before, the UK LDH was heavily influenced by Besant et all and Theosophy.

In GWU we work to the glory of the Grand Architect of the Universe and the perfection of Humanity. No definition is given regarding the GAOTU, and this is used more as a traditional statement. I am a theist myself, but most people in our obedience are atheists. We use a blank book as our VSL on the altar. It symbolizes that each individuals beliefs are unique and personal.

This is from the Women's Grand Lodge of Belgium, USA site:
(http://www.womenfreemasonsusa.com/principles.html)

"Freemasonry does not discriminate on the basis of race, religion or belief, opinion, wealth or social standing. It demands only that its members be sincere in their search for truth and devoted to the well being of their fellow men and women. It is a school for wisdom, love and harmony."

[peteprint1]

P.S.

Lynn,

I suppose that I should post from our website as well:
"http://www.georgewashingtonunion.org/"

"We accept men and women candidates, over 21 years of age, who believe in complete freedom of conscience, in democratic values, in universal human rights, and in the principles of Freemasonry as defined in Anderson’s Constitutions of 1723 and L'Appel de Strasbourg."

"The candidates must be "free" of prejudice and dogma, and willing to commit to a lifelong search for the truth through constant reflection, introspection and outward altruism. This occurs with the help of Masonic tools, practices and symbols individually and collectively engaged by candidates who become Freemasons."

- To be over 21 years old.

- To have a no criminal record.

- Not to belong to a sect or to any political or religious group based on racism, sexism or intolerance of free thought and liberty.

- To be free and of good moral character.

- To be able to pay the annual fees.

[Deleted]

Thanks peteprint1 for the info.
I myself can not get to esoteric thought and theosophy. It's interesting but I don't think that its my cup of tea either. I like the idea of a more socially active masonic group.

[peteprint1]

Then I think that you would be happiest in the WGLB or the GWU Lynn if you decide to pursue masonry. Best wishes on your journey.

[Deleted]

Thank you peteprint1, I shall consider consider booth in my decision.

[cofreemason]

Apr 18, 2011 7:37:50 GMT peteprint1 said:

Hi Lynn,
LDH in the UK does require belief in the GAOTU as a creative principle:
(http://www.droit-humain.org/uk/html/principles.html)

"Co-Freemasonry within the British Federation asserts, in accordance with the ancient declarations of Freemasonry, the existence of a Creative Principle, under the title of "The Great Architect of the Universe". It maintains the open "Volume of the Sacred Lore" in every Lodge when duly formed for Masonic purposes. It maintains the ancient landmarks of Freemasonry, and withholds recognition from all irregular and clandestine meetings, or Lodges not holding proper Charter. "

This is a limited interpretation of the actual wording of our General Regulations, which in themselves reflect our International Constitution.

Whilst our Federation "asserts a belief in a Creative Principle", it adheres to the principles of our International Constitution in that the Order does not profess to any dogma. The Lodges of our Order work to the Glory of TGAOTU and / or to the perfection of humanity.

In the British Federation, we do not place any restrictions upon the search for truth, and expect tolerance from our members.

Our Lodges are autonomous within the remit of the General Regulations and the International Constitution, and customary democratic balloting procedures determine the admission of all candidates.

As I mentioned before, the UK LDH was heavily influenced by Besant et all and Theosophy.

This is an often over-stated impression held by many outside our Federation and Order. Research past and present, however, indicates it is not quite so, and the perceived influence is quite limited and where present, optional.

We are happy to address any queries - contact details are available our various online presences (see signature file); alternatively we can be contacted directly via PM.

Fraternally,

[peteprint1]

With regards to the influence of Theosophy on British Freemasonry, here is a link to an interesting article from the site Freemason Information:

www.freemasoninformation.com/2011/04/theosophy-and-freemasonry/

It is my understanding that the French leaders of LDH, it's Zenith being in Paris, had tried to reign-in some of the theosophical elements that had developed in English Co-masonry, which led to the founding of the Eastern Order, which broke away from LDH.

[cofreemason]

Jun 1, 2011 16:35:10 GMT peteprint1 said:

With regards to the influence of Theosophy on British Freemasonry, here is a link to an interesting article from the site Freemason Information:

www.freemasoninformation.com/2011/04/theosophy-and-freemasonry/

Interesting it may be; accurate it is not. The blog is, by its own description "Masonic Traveler is one mans journey through Freemasonry. It is not a vehicle of any lodge or Grand Lodge, nor does one influence it." If it can be called 'referenced', the references are taken from sources with a Theosophical source, so it is not much of a surprise to find the author's assumptions / conclusions 'justified'.

It is my understanding that the French leaders of LDH, it's Zenith being in Paris, had tried to reign-in some of the theosophical elements that had developed in English Co-masonry, which led to the founding of the Eastern Order, which broke away from LDH.

Your understanding is incorrect on multiple grounds. Whilst our Order has it HQ in Paris, it does not per default have 'French leaders'. Our International Constitution provides for a democratically elected Supreme Council - the Executive Body of the Order. Although our current GM is French, the then GM was Icelandic.

There was no 'reigning-in'. From the earliest days of our Order our International Constitution has provided for clear landmarks in respect of the absolute freedom of conscience and the absence of dogma. The elements that were removed from the ritual were, from the earliest versions optional, but were deemed dogmatic as referencing an element that many within the British and Indian Administrations expressed to be uncomfortable with on account of it being specific to the Theosophic Philosophy.

There was no amendment of the Ritual - merely an adjustment of an optional, preliminary ceremony. Even in the earliest copy (1913) we have in our Museum, this is how this Preliminary Ceremony has been described - and ever since.

I trust this will clarify matters, but if you have any queries, we will be happy to provide further information.

Fraternally,

[cofreemason]

Apr 15, 2011 15:31:27 GMT peteprint1 said:

From my experience LDH is often Theosophically inclined, especially the British Federation...

This is manifestly incorrect. Bro. Peter, are you able to share with us what your experience with the British Federation consists of?

Membership in the very early days of the British Federation did have a strong cross-over with that of the Theosophic Society. However, as early as the 1920s there began to be some unease about what came to be seen as dogmatic elements, and lessons were learnt from this very early on - dogma and freemasonry do not sit well together.

The membership base diversified quickly after that, and even if it hadn't, the influence that once was perceived to be there would not be able to materialise because of constitutional and procedural changes.

Today, there is no particular predominance of any philosophy among our membership. Our rituals are diverse - they range from the Georges Martin Ritual and the Standard Scottish Working through to the Verulam Ritual and Lauderdale Ritual on the more elaborate end of the spectrum. Other rituals, such as the Irish Working are also in use, and the Emulation Ritual is authorised for use but is not currently worked.

Fraternally,

[peteprint1]

Sister Cora,

I apologize if my observations were offensive in any way. My impression of LDH is based on what I have read and heard, in much the same way that Masonic Traveler has acquired his information. If LDH in the English speaking jurisdictions are no longer in line with Besant and her teachings I am very pleased to hear that.

The Main LDH site is very informative, and has excellent information, none of which sounds the least bit "theosophic", however I still see such an ideology in the Honorable Order of Co-masonry and the Eastern Order, who consider Freemasonry to be the "chief modern form of the ancient Mysteries" and practices Masonry with " a conscious realization of its inner, esoteric, psychological and spiritual significance as a contemporary expression of the Mysteries."

Perhaps I have been mistaken to include LDH with these two bodies, which are LDH off-shoots. It was always my understanding that part of the reason they left LDH was precisely because the Zenith was coming down on the esoteric. I need to research that more.

Again, no dispersion was meant towards LDH. I have met several members in the past and have found them to be outstanding masons.

[peteprint1]

Additionally, I meant no offense to the Honorable Order, or the Eastern Order. I am simply stating that in my opinion, they are esoteric and theosophically inclined. That is not meant to be pejorative.

[reprobatus]

In defence of Bro. Pete, I have to say that my own (obviously erroneous) impression of LDH was that it was heavily influenced by theosophy.

Having said that, before I joined the Craft I had many erroneous impressions of Masonry in general!

S&F,

R.

[peteprint1]

Jun 7, 2011 18:20:06 GMT @goatrider said:

Jun 6, 2011 23:05:42 GMT cofreemason said:

This is manifestly incorrect.

It's a natural inclination for individuals to look at where an organization has been so that they will understand where it's headed. In Masonry, that can be problematic.

I have to admit that my perception of LDH is colored because of the Theosophic bent of some of its early leaders, such as Besant, and, if I am not mistaken, wasn't Leadbetter part of the organization as well?

Thanks for taking the time to post on the topic.

Yes, Leadbeater was involved with the Order and Besant.

According to the book "Women's Agency and Rituals in Mixed and Female Masonic Orders" by Alexandra Heidle et. al.:

"In 1915, Charles Webster Leadbeater-since 1896 the personal theoretician of Annie Besant in the Theosophical Society-was initiated into LDH. The next year Leadbeater and James Ingall Wedgwood-another member of LDH and the Theosophical Society-revised the rituals with which the English speaking part of LDH was working "according to the Astral instructions of the Count of Saint-Germain."

According to the book, the ritual was further revised by Besant and Leadbeater in 1925.

A very interesting subject of study, and a great book. It's available online on google books; the purchase price for a hard-copy is exorbitant.

[peteprint1]

Jun 7, 2011 20:02:34 GMT reprobatus said:

In defence of Bro. Pete, I have to say that my own (obviously erroneous) impression of LDH was that it was heavily influenced by theosophy.

Having said that, before I joined the Craft I had many erroneous impressions of Masonry in general!

S&F,

R.

Thank you Brother Reprobatus,

The misconceptions are many before we enter through the West Gate. I learn more everyday.