Builders Of The Adytum/Golden Dawn

[thisisnecessary]

Are there any BOTA members here? I have a few of Paul Foster Case's books, but still there are many who say its no replacement for the BOTA course material.

I've heard the material can last for years. My question would be, why couldn't I just go straight to the source for this material? Why would I bother being a dues-paying member, if they are just charging me for a compendium of courses, a few chapters at a time? Maybe I am not understanding its structure correctly, or maybe I am just too skeptical of being ripped off when there are plenty of books and other organizations to look into that may or may not offer the same information or experiences.

My interest in the BOTA stems mainly from the fact that I have little faith that I will enjoy any of the current incarnations of the Golden Dawn. I'm not sure about all the differences between each one(and I suppose I could say the same about Rosicrucian Fellowship or AMORC, but the Masonic Rosicrucian Society I am still hoping to find my way into soon...)

Any thoughts?

[zlogic]

Hi there! I've been in BOTA for about a year and have found it of great value. I first found the complete source material, then I decided to become a monthly member. As a result I'm several months "behind" and still can't yet join in their local monthly Pronaos ritual.

You can go straight to a copy of the source but it may be edited at critical points, incomplete or simply out of date. Magically, something might be said for being a nominal member. Other that, it's just more spiritually correct to support a source you value & use.

[Alberich]

I've been a nominal member for a few years and I don't worry about being magically correct. I don't go to any of the Pronaos rituals b/c they don't have any groups near Nibelheim.

As for the completeness of the original source material, I recently found an interesting piece on one of the Yahoo groups. It was a complete transcript, although the end was missing, of Paul Case and Ann Davies channeling a demon through a Ouija board. It was giving them instructions. Some of the members of that board felt that publishing the transcript of the conversation that they had with this thing would completely astonish the esoteric world. The thread went on for a few weeks. Tempers flared.

Mostly, it was fairly boring but I downloaded it anyway. You never know when that stuff will come in handy.

I recall that there was a schism between Paul Case and Moina Mathers of the Golden Dawn when he started talking about sex, magic, and the higher polarities in lodge.

You must wholly alter your conception of sex in order to comprehend the Ancient Wisdom. It is the interior nervous organism, not the external organs, that is always meant in phallic symbolism, and the force that works through these interior centers is the Great Magical Agent, the divine serpent fire.

--The Book of Tokens

i.e., he's talking about Kundalini fire, but some insist it's the devil.

Some Masons get a little squeamish whenever "sex" and "magic" are used together in the same sentence. They ought to avoid the Tarot altogether.

Also, Case didn't like people using Enochian magic because it makes you go crazy. Albert Pike includes the Enochian alphabet in the Scottish Rite; in fact, we just revealed the secret "name" last month to a brand new class so that they could get another page stamped in their passports. One grumpy and bored Brother, eager for the donuts, kept checking his watch a few times.

Anyway. I seldom discuss any of the BOTA teachings on masonic fora or around Masons nowadays, b/c every time that I do, I get accused of trying to be a smartypants, and usually someone complains about my posts.

[r4a]

New here but I thought the whole point was to seek truth, no matter where it takes you, and fear nothing but your own inadequacies. Inbreds, even purportedly enlightened but still ignorant, should be sat in the corner to contemplate their value to the singular truth. If they are not championing that axiom, challenge them, if they are capable of building any argument, and if not, dismiss them as anything more than chatter. Rudeness is not required.

[seekinglight]

Hey, if you're not on the left-hand path I think you would have some objections to B.O.T.A. I was a member of B.O.T.A. for a few months, and I really liked it WHILE I was a member. That being said, the issue doesn't present itself until a few months into the course material. At first, the teaching on the 15th tarot key (the devil) claims that satan does not exist. This I had no problem with, because I was pretty open-minded spiritually. It then proceeds to refer to the devil as 'His Satanic Majesty' (in the same lesson). Perhaps this is explained at a later time, but B.O.T.A. seemed to me to be a left-hand path order masquerading as a right-hand path order. The Biblical quote: 'For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.' really rings true here.

[peter2]

I used to know the area supervisor for BOTA. He was an excellent and upright man. All the other members of BOTA that I have known were working for the Light.

[seekinglight]

I don't doubt that there are plenty of good people in B.O.T.A. However, I don't think the order itself is in the best interests of those it is claiming to serve. I remember what started the spiritual awakening I had (which I in turn perverted) that lead up to me joining B.O.T.A. was over being rejected by someone who I had very strong feelings for. I remember writing my feelings down on paper and writing (from the best of my memory): "God I don't want to be dead anymore. Come to me so that I may have life, for the way of mortals is a living death." I remember then being torn between good and evil, I remember when writing in my journal something to the effect of: "I will not walk through Hell to get her, Hell will have to walk through me". The saying 'Be careful what you wish for' is good advice, lol. I wanted power, but I didn't have entirely malicious intentions. I then joined B.O.T.A. I used the principals I learned to attract someone to me, although I did not directly influence someone, as I had gained some more self-restraint by that time. I think what may have resulted in a karmic backlash for me was that even though I was not attempting to influence anyone in particular, I would still have to be influencing someone's free will in doing that, although I didn't really raise this issue with myself at the time. My next goal after I attracted someone was to relieve anyone who came to me suffering from a psychological or spiritual crisis. Shortly after this, I received the lesson the 15th Tarot Key. I don't know if I would consider myself a Christian at the time, and if I was, my faith was weak and I had (and still do have) extremely limited knowledge of the Holy Bible. Now, for an order to claim that Satan does not exist, and then, maybe a paragraph or two later, refer to the Devil as 'His Satanic Majesty', seems to me to be nothing but outright deception. I think maybe trying to use my knowledge for good might have resulted in good karma, which I think (although this decision was ultimately up to the Lord and no one else) have resulted in me completely overcoming the most dangerous period in my life. I do not doubt that there are many otherwise good people in many deceptive esoteric orders. I think what leads to a lot of people joining is a feeling of powerlessness, which people then either intentionally or unintentionally, misconstrue as them being more spiritually advanced than the average person. Thanks for reading and I'd love to hear your thoughts on this.

[peter2]

Nov 18, 2015 23:54:36 GMT seekinglight said:

,,,refer to the Devil as 'His Satanic Majesty', seems to me to be nothing but outright deception. ...

I have been surprised at how much deception goes on. 

Perhaps you could scan the document and post it so that others can see your evidence.

[pan0ptic]

I'm somewhat familiar with the B.O.T.A - i've perused PFC's book on the tarot. I found it very informative. As for the drama which surrounds B.O.T.A members, I can't speak but I appreciate your willingness to help explain it. I can relate to the feelings of rejection you experienced though. In my case I was assaulted - blatantly - and then slandered to make it seem like it was my fault. It was the darkest period in my life and its a wonder that i survived. In hindsight it all seems so 'orchestrated' because what person in their right mind would intentionally evoke subcortical rage? Only a woman would dare to kick a bear in the nuts. lol

Anyhow probably too much information

[seekinglight]

I will, but it's going to be a few weeks before I can do that because I would have to order replacement lessons. Some time after I received that lesson, I shredded all of my lessons and burned them. I believe that they still consider you a nominal member even after you attempt to sever all ties with them, so I could order replacements. I'll let you know.

[seekinglight]

Hey, I actually just Googled the phrase "His Satanic Majesty" and it appears to be a synonym for Satan (obviously), so I could be misinterpreting PFC's intentions here. Possibly he was just poetically referring to Satan as 'His Satanic Majesty', but I'm a bit lost as to why he would use that phrase in particular. I will still order a replacement of that lesson, and show the parts that I referenced. I'm not going to order earlier lesson replacements, and I wouldn't anyways, because I don't want people who would misuse their power to have knowledge of practical occultism. Now, this could be a case of a simple misunderstanding, but it still seems quite odd to me that PFC would use the term 'His Satanic Majesty'. If he was attempting to glorify Satan with this term and use it to deceive people, then I absolutely have a huge problem with B.O.T.A. If this is all a misunderstanding, then although I would not rejoin for personal reasons, I would not say that PFC himself was trying to deliberately manipulate people. I actually found this book (obviously a very heavy Christian bias if you read it), that does not glorify Satan at all and still use the term 'his Satanic majesty': www.sacred-texts.com/chr/gc/gc31.htm

The other thing that sort of rose questions with me was that he capitalized every letter of the phrase 'His Satanic Majesty', giving the term some sort of reverence. Possibly he was just trying to use proper grammar. I'm honestly a bit lost. Either he was attempting to glorify Satan and deceive people, or he had an extremely poor choice of words, lol. But to give you some context, from what I remember off the top of my head, the phrase was lead into like this ". . . and later incorporated into Set and other notions of His Satanic Majesty" 

The context to me seemed to imply that although he believed that deities from other religions were false, he still literally believed in Satan. Which, then, of course, would make his assertion that the Devil does not exist an outright deception. Make of it what you will, this is the best information I can provide until I get the replacement lesson. 

[pan0ptic]

Mar 27, 2012 18:13:02 GMT -7 Alberich said:
I've been a nominal member for a few years and I don't worry about being magically correct.


Me neither...It seems that i've never been in control, i'm always just going along for the ride. it's convenient to think that i'm actually the doer..but in reality i feel like an *ss that someone always rides in on.

[seekinglight]

I should also make it clear that I believe the Bible forbids occult practices for good reason. The issue I feel often times with the occult, as was previously mentioned on this post, you don't have power to do any of these sorts of things yourself. Therefore, an unseen force (which I would presume most occult practitioners aren't aware of who/what this force exactly is), is calling the shots. It seems pretty naive to me to let a force that you don't know the intentions of have influence over your life and the things that happen to you. The sad thing is, there are probably a lot of people wrapped up in occultism that have nothing but good intentions, but I would compare attempting to use the forces of the occult for good like trying to heal a man with a scalpel dipped in a sea of viruses and bacteria.

[pan0ptic]

Nov 19, 2015 15:40:43 GMT pan0ptic said:

I'm somewhat familiar with the B.O.T.A - i've perused PFC's book on the tarot. I found it very informative. As for the drama which surrounds B.O.T.A members, I can't speak but I appreciate your willingness to help explain it. I can relate to the feelings of rejection you experienced though. In my case I was assaulted - blatantly - and then slandered to make it seem like it was my fault. It was the darkest period in my life and its a wonder that i survived. In hindsight it all seems so 'orchestrated' because what person in their right mind would intentionally evoke subcortical rage? Only a woman would dare to kick a bear in the nuts. lol

Anyhow probably too much information

me too..thanks

[peter2]

Nov 20, 2015 3:38:39 GMT seekinglight said:

I should also make it clear that I believe the Bible forbids occult practices for good reason.

I rather thought that Moses was pretty good at occult practices - parting the Red Sea, water from the rock...


And what of the secret practices of the kabbalah?

[seekinglight]

I would say that perhaps things were different back then. Maybe it was possible to obtain spiritual power through God. My issue is with the occult, because of the general ignorance within the occult community as to where the power is actually coming from. From what I understand, the power often comes from a malicious source. There are unseen forces involved that a good portion of occultists aren't aware of, I think. As for the Kabbalah, I wouldn't consider studying the Kabbalah to be evil. I heard this analogy from Bill Schnoebelen (who usually turns a lot of people off with his assertion that Freemasonry is Luciferian in nature), and it was a comparison between mathematics. In his view, the Kabbalah is much more complex and study of it shouldn't be attempted by someone who doesn't even have a solid foundation in something such as the Holy Bible. He compared trying to study the Kabbalah before you've read the Holy Bible to attempting calculus before you've learned to add and subtract. I think he's spot-on with that analogy.

[peter2]

Nov 21, 2015 19:10:53 GMT seekinglight said:

..From what I understand, the power often comes from a malicious source. ,,,, I wouldn't consider studying the Kabbalah to be evil.

There are certainly more than a few Christian organisations that are badly contaminated - and have been for long periods of time.   From my observation, dark church buildings are more common in Western Europe.


The Kabbalah  has its own problems.  Like all spiritual practices, it is embedded in an inner plane entity and all practitioners are at risk of operating within the aura of that entity.  The entity (or more accurately - set of entities) over-lighting the Kabbalah/Cabalah/Qabalah is itself embedded in a previous era and therefore it is difficult to be of the new cycle while practicing an old system.

There are other previous-era spiritual systems, both in the East and West and if we have not completed their lessons then it may be proper to stay with them until we have.

[pan0ptic]

The Kabbalah... what a fascinating study. I was initially extremely partial to Laitman. My mind was blown daily with the complexity of the thoughts he shared and all in just a few sentences. But, I was like a sponge at the time and everything had meaning so I tended to down-play its importance. All in all, I think it was the most stimulating study I've ever embarked on. Coming in a close second was the short by HPB, The voice of silence. Then, believe it or not, M&D by AP. After reading that last one was when the trouble started, lol. It was then that I realized too much. My head became bloated with the machinations of a thousand plus years of lore. I'm recovering though. Don't know about any occult powers however? I always thought that meant control over ones shadow self, in the Jungian sense?

[peter2]

The preferred path to occult powers is to establish right relationships with the entities internal in the human system and thereby learn right relationship with external entities.

The more public path of using ritual and lower will to compel cooperation is of course most dangerous as the biographies of magicians attest.

[pan0ptic]

Nov 24, 2015 20:26:06 GMT peter2 said:

The preferred path to occult powers is to establish right relationships with the entities internal in the human system and thereby learn right relationship with external entities.

Hi peter2,

So I wasn't that far off then in my definition minus an equally important detail - right relationships.

The more public path of using ritual and lower will to compel cooperation is of course most dangerous as the biographies of magicians attest.

Agreed, if I understand you correctly. Essentially what you've said boils down to the quite natural (as in widespread) use of 'dark triad' traits (not necessarily consciously) to impose ones will on their environment for purely carnal results. i.e., I try to fortuitously manipulate my environment to enhance my reproductive fitness and/or the fitness of my group (group fitness). Isn't this the method of nature though, notwithstanding ontological arguments of origination?

Pan