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Post by hollandr on Jul 24, 2005 5:33:13 GMT
Brethren I must admit that tolerance encourages me. And I understand the mental frustration that Ruff may experience reading my material. But, Ruff, do you know what is it that is frustrated? Stewart >>As a result this human race is under close observation from the central sun (in the Pleiades) and from the greater central sun. >If you mean Sirius here I would agree. Well there is certainly observation by Sirian representatives of which The Widow is the best known. But my suspicion is that the logos of the Sirius system is a brother of our solar logos - that is one of the seven solar systems that are said to rotate around the Central Sun. So if the solar logos is our heavenly father then the Central Sun is our heavenly grandfather. I am satisfied that the Central Sun is in the Pleiades. I cannot confirm which star but it said to be Alcyone. Here are some comments on the Pleiades laluni.helloyou.ws/netnews/bk/astrology/astr1244.html"The Pleiades are to the solar system the source of electrical energy....." "Three great waves of energy sweep cyclically through the entire solar system from...the Seven Sisters, the Pleiades, from that one in particular who is occultly termed "the wife" of the planetary Logos whose scheme will eventually receive the seeds of life from our planet ..." "The Pleiades are the central group of the system of sidereal astronomy.......They are thus considered (Alcyone, in particular) as the central point around which our universe of fixed stars revolves." But the bee hives (if you have them) on the collars are a reference to the Greater Central Sun around which our Central Sun rotates. To be more specific they are a reference to the female qualities of the GC Sun and thus may be referred to as our Heavenly Great Grandmother. She can reasonably be called The Great Mother. Now the Great Mother approached our lodge some time ago during a working. And I saw for the first time the covering of the temple as a miniature of the heavens - indigo with starry sparkles. And the next day when the candidate tells us he was received into the ethereal temple in the heavens in a form very similar to his first degree. While I have seen the temple in the heavens myself, that is the first instance in which I have heard of a masonic candidate experiencing the higher temple in connection with a lodge working. There are some technical reasons for it happening here, but if it has happened here then it can happen elsewhere. The renewal of Masonry is at hand if we can reach out to it. Best wishes to all true and faithful brethren Russell
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Jul 24, 2005 5:45:14 GMT
"Ruff, do you know what is it that is frustrated?"
Nothing is frustrated: the trouble is you keep giving completely irrational meanings for perfectly ordinary things.
For example, the beehive is a symbol of industry, the hive organised like a Lodge, the Queen its Master: its labours produce honey and wax, that is, sweetness and light.
It has nothing whatever to do with the Greater Central Sun around which our Central Sun rotates - whatever the hell that is supposed to be.
You are giving visitors the false idea that all Masonry is about is loony ideas and psychic weirdo stuff. Yes, I know, the Hermetic has its place. The Hermetic, not the completely fanciful.
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Post by hollandr on Jul 24, 2005 6:47:32 GMT
Ruff
and here was I thinking that Masonry is veiled in allegory and it turns out that it is all completely obvious.
>the hive organised like a Lodge
I understand the males are expendable in a hive. After the mating the remaining males have their wings cut off and are turned out to contend with the ants.
Perhaps you are thinking of women-only masonry. (Sisters - I am not serious)
And here is the origin of the sweetness: Job 38:31 Dost thou bind sweet influences of Kimah? Youngs literal translation. Kimah is the Pleiades
Cheers
Russell
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Post by a on Jul 24, 2005 10:34:17 GMT
Russell
Thank you for the information and weblink. My understanding of the Pleiades is somewhat (very) limited at present. But I will work on that.
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jmd
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Post by jmd on Jul 24, 2005 11:21:17 GMT
I must admit to finding much of this thread somewhat disjointed and a little unclear as to the direction it is taking in terms of esoteric freemasonic discussion.
On the one hand, the very title and opening posts are unclear (to my perhaps too literal reading) as to the relationship between space travel and masonry.
On another, there are the fantastic references to Dune, to Shakespeare, to Douglas Adams, and to the Bible that I find each and all quite worthy of further reflection, and a pleasant reminiscence enters as I read lines that calls to mind these texts.
Then, there is that rather small but important consideration mentioned by Russell that I would certainly like to hear more about. I may not agree with much of the views propounded regarding the Pleides and the Freemasonic connection, but would, nonetheless, be interested in dicussing where his sentence 'I have seen an outline of possible rituals - in image form' may collectively lead us as we strive to harmoniously consider possibilities.
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Post by whistler on Jul 24, 2005 19:37:25 GMT
Jmd, As always this thread has wandered a little but that is normal on this forum, and keeps it interesting. As to the Masonic connection and space travel, for those who take Masonry back to Egypt, and then Hancock's books about Orion and Egypt there is a path to consider. Back on Topic, with the Universe so vast, there must be a way to get around it. OK we can slip into the Astral and go to all sorts of places but that way raises the question of what form we would be when we get to a planet a million light years away. It is highly unlikely, in the whole of the universe planet earth is the only one with physically solid life forms. All of which means thinking outside the "Square"
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giovanni
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Post by giovanni on Jul 24, 2005 19:45:13 GMT
As I previously stated, I had once an experience of travelling outside my body. This has, however, no connection with masonic spirituality. Just "crumbs for the whelps".
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Post by whistler on Jul 24, 2005 20:00:50 GMT
As I previously stated, I had once an experience of traveling outside my body. This has, however, no connection with masonic spirituality. Just "crumbs for the whelps". Giovanni, Spirituality is something that moves as knowledge becomes gained.. If / when it becomes possible to travel through space it will not be a spiritual journey, it will be possible with new knowledge.. The difference between walking barefoot - and traveling in a 747, is not a spiritual journey Any more than the difference between throwing a rock at a cliff, and sending a rocket from Earth to a tiny Jupiter Moon is a spiritual advancement. There is interesting logistics to consider when thinking how you and me would be able to travel through the universe not least the body structure we would need to cope with different atmosphere and gravity at our destiny. At the thoughts of what might happen when travelling faster than the speed of light, or does one find a "Door" to go through which allows travel in a different dimension. mmmmmmmmmm
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giovanni
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Post by giovanni on Jul 25, 2005 3:00:31 GMT
Whistler, once I travelled out of my body. It was quite exciting, to see how my powers worked. Spirituality is however another thing: for instance, the invisible chain of love that ties us all. At least IMO.
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Post by whistler on Jul 25, 2005 10:00:26 GMT
Whistler, once I traveled out of my body. It was quite exciting, to see how my powers worked. Spirituality is however another thing: for instance, the invisible chain of love that ties us all. At least IMO. Giovanni, The chain of Love is the most powerful force inn the Universe, it will overcome any other emotion, a couple of years ago whilst Ghost Busting an especially nasty unpleasant entity attached itself to my partner, it was only by repeating very very strongly that it was loved, I was able to break through its snarls and growls, calm it down and move it on. (for those who haven't been ghost busting - No we are not complete nutters- though to look from the outside without knowledge of what is happening when we are working many would think we should be locked up as raving lunatics- However we lunatics have cleared, Pubs, Houses, Factories all sorts of places) Back to love pick on somebody or something that really makes you cross -send the thought of love to it, bit hard at the start but keep doing it and be surprised at your reaction
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Post by maat on Aug 17, 2005 0:58:02 GMT
Ruffashlar - a gentle reminder that most genius's (did not want to use genii for obvious reasons) of the past were considered loony. Russell - don't get a big head...sometimes I wonder about you - in a nice way of course. Perhaps it is of interest that 413 people have bothered to read a thread on an improbability. They could have assumed that the travel was not of the bodily type and are a bit loony themselves (or Harry Potter fans.) Someone asked what has all this got to do with Freemasonry. Weeeelllll - Our VSL (the Bible) is really all about traveling - to a heavenly city. Its pretty obvious we are not going to do that with a physical body- so if we attach such value to the Sacred Texts we must be allowing some validity to fact that there is part of us that can travel above and beyond what we "know". Sometimes I think that apart from the tradition of keeping the Freemasonic secrets(?) it really for the protection of those that experience them. We get back to the old "how do you tell a blind man about the colour yellow?" and you cannot sign to a deaf man about a particular sound. Now for ruff... another tie, but a bit more scientific. Below is a copy of a piece I posted on the Zodiac thread which may explain a little about how one may travel through space using a little bit of knowledge from Freemasonry. "We had a brilliant speaker at our last Royal Arch meeting - who pointed out that scientists are now thinking, like Plato, Da Vince and Kepler, that the Universe is shaped like a soccer ball...a dodecahedron, which has 12 sides. Below is the link to a report by Dr David Whitehouse....BBC News Online science editor news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3175352.stmOur speaker went on to point out the dual nature of and affinity that the dodecahedron and the icosahedron have, and that each can produce each other inwards endlessly and outwards endlessly/eternally?! home.swipnet.se/polyhedra/tff-DDD.htmIF the Universe has a 12 sided shape one can well imagine each shape having a specific quality or influence as suggested by the 12 signs of the Zodiac. These influences would affect us depending of our particular place within that sphere, at any particular time. To bring the Greater to the Smaller we need to take into consideration the duality mentioned above. Interestingly enough - the dodecahedron symbolises the Universe, Planets and Fixed Stars while the icosahedron is symbolic of water - our main constituent. Of even more interest is that the "key" to understanding this model and how it works is the Tetraktys." I believe that the Tetraktys is the key to non bodily travel...a point, a line extended by moving at right angles to itself ad infinitum could be the key. For the loony readers - I actually 'physically' experienced this movement (even though my body did not move), just before my one and only out of body experience (and unimaginative me just went to the kitchen-been kicking myself ever since)! For all the non Masonic readers - most Freemasons are non esoteric and of the non-loony type. Just very ordinary people with good hearts and a wish to improve themselves so that they may become more serviceable to their fellow man. The magic of Masonry is that it stimulates the individual mind at its own level. Maat
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Post by maat on Aug 21, 2005 23:50:53 GMT
Just last week I said somewhere in this Forum that I usually experienced something first and then the explanation, usually in the form of a book, 'just came my way' some time afterward. Well this happened over the weekend with relation to my experiencing a 'turn' of the body before leaving it, as mentioned above. Here below is an extract from the Emerald Tablets of Thoth (Hermes Trismegistus) - Tablet X - The Key of Time "Once, in a past time, I spoke to the Dweller. Asked of the mystery of time and space. Asked him the question that surged in my being, saying: "O Master, what is time?" Then to me spoke He, the Master: "Know ye, O Thoth, in the beginning there was void and nothingness: a timeless, spaceless, nothingness. And into the nothingness came a thought, purposeful, all-pervading, and It filled the Void.And I questioned the Master, saying: "Was this thought eternal?" And answered me the Dweller, saying: "In the beginning, there was eternal thought, and for thought to be eternal, time must exist. So into the all-pervading thought grew the Law of Time. Aye, time which exists through all space, floating in a smooth, rhythmic movement that is eternally in a state of fixation. Time changes not, but all things change in time. For time is the force that holds events separate, each in its proper place. Time is not in motion, but ye move through time as your consciousness moves from one event to another. Aye, by time ye exist, all in all, an eternal One existence. Know ye that even though in time ye are separate, yet still are One in all times existent." Ceased then the voice of the Dweller, and departed I to ponder on time. For knew I that in these words lay wisdom and a way to explore the mysteries of time. Oft did I ponder the words of the Dweller. Then sought I to solve the mystery of time. Found I that time moves through strange angles. Yet only by curves could I hope to attain the key that would give me access to the time-space. Found I that only by moving upward and yet again by moving to right-ward could I be free from the time of this movement. Forth I came from out of my body, moved in movements that changed me in time. Strange were the sights I saw in my journeys, many the mysteries that open to view. Aye, saw I man's beginning, learned from the past that nothing is new. Seek ye, O man, to learn the pathway that leads through the spaces that are formed forth in time." We leave Doreal's interpretation of the Emerald Tablets here, although I will be making reference to other parts of it on different threads. Back to me….. I have to admit that the aforesaid strikes a chord with me, although I do not profess to understand it all. Are there any indications in the symbols and allegories of Freemasonry? The immediate one that sprang to mind was the circumambulations which are executed in a certain manner for most movements around a lodge room BUT different in certain parts of the third and this just before freedom is attained? Enough for now - I must fly?! Maat
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Post by hollandr on Aug 22, 2005 2:24:20 GMT
Maat
If you search around in early depictions of the 3rd degree you may find an image showing what look like small flames on the floor around the candidate.
These "flames" are energy arising from the earth that have the potential capacity to push the candidate out of the body.
If the 3rd degree were done in egyptian form with suitable brethren in the columns the candidate would be driven forth from the body by sound and would most definitely see the sun even though the ritual might be occurring close to midnight.
Cheers
Russell
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Post by maat on Aug 23, 2005 4:19:16 GMT
The Disciples and Mary when gathered in the Upper Chamber after the death of Jesus are pictured with small flames above their heads also. Back to the space Travel - the site below has a few useful sketches of the relationship of the the Tetraktys and Space.. www.aiwaz.net/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=48Maat
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Post by hollandr on Aug 23, 2005 5:38:52 GMT
>The Disciples and Mary when gathered in the Upper Chamber after the death of Jesus are pictured with small flames above their heads also
I saw it once when the group being of the community learned to control the mental plane. The process in the group meditation at that time was just like the pentecostal imagery with the fire of the higher mind energising those present.
I consider that a different process to the earth mother pushing energy up into the lodge room
Cheers
Russell
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Aug 23, 2005 16:07:55 GMT
I consider that a different process to the earth mother pushing energy up into the lodge room
You still have to pay your gas bill like everyone else, mate.
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staffs
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Post by staffs on Aug 23, 2005 19:22:36 GMT
Ruff,Russell.
it is really good to see both your opinions being aired on the forum and being discussed rationally.
Should we be thinking of a thread entitled the Ruff and russ show ;D
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ruffashlar
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Post by ruffashlar on Aug 25, 2005 14:27:38 GMT
Later, with Tools-and-Jewels Holland, maybe?
Or, Ruff Ashlar's Madhouse.
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Post by maat on Sept 5, 2005 0:48:49 GMT
Just posted this on the Tree of Life thread but thought you may find it interesting to read about someone famous who could not only travel through Space but also Time. > When you try to do this on a map you have to allow for energy following the lines of least resistance. For example, Tipharet on the eastern Aust Tree is at Broken Hill - attracted by a large ore body. Cheers Russell I have just come across this info - very interesting for me - Broken Hill is my birthplace. I can attest that there is a very special energy there. I feel it every time I go back, which is not often these days. Did you know that Broken Hill was the site of Lilliput in Gullivers Travels? Apparently Jonathon Swift had coordinates in his story that placed it at Broken Hill....Swift never left England but used to have unusual dreams(?!) in which he travelled to other places. Interesting enough he saw black people in the same area. Broken Hill has most unusual Flora - most of the shrubs take the shape in miniature trees. Maybe this would be of interest to all those readers of How to Travel through Space (and Time or so it would seem from the information below) www.trivia-library.com/b/jonathon-swift-and-the-moons-of-mars.htmMaat
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giovanni
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Post by giovanni on Sept 6, 2005 5:58:52 GMT
Should we be thinking of a thread entitled the Ruff and russ show ;D
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