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Post by leonardo on Jan 5, 2010 14:45:01 GMT
I am interested in learning more about Independent Lodges. I can appreciate that Ritual wise they’ll be similar to others, but how do they interact with lodges similarly motivated? Do they, for example, form affiliations? And, if so, do such affiliations affect their respected independence.
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 6, 2010 17:04:08 GMT
I am interested in learning more about Independent Lodges. I can appreciate that Ritual wise they’ll be similar to others, but how do they interact with lodges similarly motivated? Do they, for example, form affiliations? And, if so, do such affiliations affect their respected independence. Leo, I can on speak from my own experience so your mileage may very. My lodge and other lodges who identify themselves as Post-Modern Freemasons interact via a cooperative-community structure. No hierarchy, no lodge rules over another. We help each other, work together but no lodge is more important or "outranks" another. Independent lodge sovereignty is paramount. We also have affiliations with established grand bodies but those affiliations also do not have any impact on individual lodge sovereignty. If they ever did those affiliations would cease. I hope this helped. Love and Light,
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Post by leonardo on Jan 6, 2010 18:12:34 GMT
It certainly did help. Thanks for that.
So, does this mean it’s possible for inter-visitation to take place between those Lodges that share this common approach?
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Post by lauderdale on Jan 6, 2010 18:15:01 GMT
Sounds good to me Bro Brad. I imagine that is how things were with the original Lodges of Stonemasons. Certain matters agreed amongst the Brotherhood but each Lodge autonomous under its elected Master.
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Post by leonardo on Jan 6, 2010 18:20:23 GMT
I imagine you're right on that. It must have been that way; it all had to start somewhere and somehow.
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 6, 2010 18:44:10 GMT
It certainly did help. Thanks for that. So, does this mean it’s possible for inter-visitation to take place between those Lodges that share this common approach? Brother Leo, Yes, inter-visitation and cross membership are allowed. We strive to treat each other as extended family if you where. Love and Light,
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 6, 2010 18:45:44 GMT
Sounds good to me Bro Brad. I imagine that is how things were with the original Lodges of Stonemasons. Certain matters agreed amongst the Brotherhood but each Lodge autonomous under its elected Master. Exactly Bro. Steve ;D I have found that for me there is nothing better than this approach. We really are equals. I have had the chance to travel and sit in many lodges with more to come. I really see no drawbacks. Love and Light,
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vtmason
Member
Running Dog Lackey
Posts: 251
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Post by vtmason on Jan 7, 2010 12:57:39 GMT
I've seen only a couple of independent lodges. My personal experiences are that they are more interested in philosophical growth and so forth than they are inter visits and affiliations. It is certainly an interesting concept
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 8, 2010 22:44:35 GMT
I've seen only a couple of independent lodges. My personal experiences are that they are more interested in philosophical growth and so forth than they are inter visits and affiliations. It is certainly an interesting concept The work of an independent lodge does tend to be very demanding. In the USA independent lodges are still a rarity but that status is changing every day. In continental Europe and South America , independents are now a majority in many places. Those who choose to work together often do. I have sat in quite a few independent lodges and I am sure I will sit in more to come. It is always exciting because there is always something different and unique about the individual lodges. Love and Light,
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Post by jeddye on Jan 10, 2010 3:13:19 GMT
You know, I've been interested in joining Freemasonry for a while, but I don't really understand the difference between regular and irregular lodges... And what's with these post modern lodges? Never heard of that before. What's that all about?
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 10, 2010 4:39:15 GMT
You know, I've been interested in joining Freemasonry for a while, but I don't really understand the difference between regular and irregular lodges... And what's with these post modern lodges? Never heard of that before. What's that all about? Welcome to the forum. Regularity is Masonic procedure that is strictly determined by each jurisdiction or Masonic order according to their own criteria. Just as no one Mason speaks for Freemasonry, neither does one organization. So, for Masons to label other Masons as "irregular" simply shows their own ignorance of Masonic protocol and procedures. If you would like more information on Post-Modern Freemasonry I suggest you check out the links in my signature as well as some of our lodge blogs. lodgehera.blogspot.comlodgenapoleon.blogspot.comWe also have a Facebook group that is dedicated to Post-Modern Freemasonry: www.facebook.com/#/group.php?gid=176863399179&ref=tsIf you have further questions feel free to post a new topic or IM me. I will help as much as I can. Love and Light,
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Post by letterorhalveit3 on Jan 10, 2010 11:41:49 GMT
You know, I've been interested in joining Freemasonry for a while, but I don't really understand the difference between regular and irregular lodges... And what's with these post modern lodges? Never heard of that before. What's that all about? Welcome to the forum. Regularity is Masonic procedure that is strictly determined by each jurisdiction or Masonic order according to their own criteria. Just as no one Mason speaks for Freemasonry, neither does one organization. So, for Masons to label other Masons as "irregular" simply shows their own ignorance of Masonic protocol and procedures. If you would like more information on Post-Modern Freemasonry I suggest you check out the links in my signature as well as some of our lodge blogs. lodgehera.blogspot.comlodgenapoleon.blogspot.comWe also have a Facebook group that is dedicated to Post-Modern Freemasonry: www.facebook.com/#/group.php?gid=176863399179&ref=tsIf you have further questions feel free to post a new topic or IM me. I will help as much as I can. Love and Light, Actually, use of the terms "irregular" or "clandestine" does nothing like show ignorance of a given Masonic body's own protocol. For example, under the jursidiction of my own Grand Lodge, your Post Modern lodges are irregular. So when I take my obligation not to associate Masonically with irregular or clandestine Lodges or Masons, I am doing so as my Grand Lodge defines the terms and not, as you would indicate, following or admitting that there is any body that speaks for all of Masonry. When I use the terms I use them to refer to those obediences and Masons deemed irregular by the Constitutions of my own Grand Lodge.
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 10, 2010 18:01:52 GMT
Welcome to the forum. Regularity is Masonic procedure that is strictly determined by each jurisdiction or Masonic order according to their own criteria. Just as no one Mason speaks for Freemasonry, neither does one organization. So, for Masons to label other Masons as "irregular" simply shows their own ignorance of Masonic protocol and procedures. If you would like more information on Post-Modern Freemasonry I suggest you check out the links in my signature as well as some of our lodge blogs. lodgehera.blogspot.comlodgenapoleon.blogspot.comWe also have a Facebook group that is dedicated to Post-Modern Freemasonry: www.facebook.com/#/group.php?gid=176863399179&ref=tsIf you have further questions feel free to post a new topic or IM me. I will help as much as I can. Love and Light, Actually, use of the terms "irregular" or "clandestine" does nothing like show ignorance of a given Masonic body's own protocol. For example, under the jursidiction of my own Grand Lodge, your Post Modern lodges are irregular. So when I take my obligation not to associate Masonically with irregular or clandestine Lodges or Masons, I am doing so as my Grand Lodge defines the terms and not, as you would indicate, following or admitting that there is any body that speaks for all of Masonry. When I use the terms I use them to refer to those obediences and Masons deemed irregular by the Constitutions of my own Grand Lodge. Those rules are in place to restrict you, as a member under their jurisdiction. They mean nothing to anyone outside of their jurisdictional control. So to project your restrictions upon others is ignorant, and downright foolish. The same effect that a Southern Baptist telling a Northern Baptists that they are "irregular" or "clandestine" Christians. So what? Love and Light,
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Post by leonardo on Jan 10, 2010 19:00:41 GMT
Brothers, please let keep this thread on topic; Independent Lodges, not the question of what is or isn’t “Regular.”
If you wish to discuss such an issue, then by all means do... but on another thread, and by keeping it civil.
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 10, 2010 19:28:36 GMT
I agree Brother Leo. I have enjoyed the relative peace and calm that has been around here latley.
Back on topic. I am aware of independent lodges in England and Scotland but none yet in Ireland. I will let you know when changes in that situation develop.
The number of independents increase every day.
Love and Light,
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Post by leonardo on Jan 10, 2010 19:35:39 GMT
I agree Brother Leo. I have enjoyed the relative peace and calm that has been around here latley. Back on topic. I am aware of independent lodges in England and Scotland but none yet in Ireland. I will let you know when changes in that situation develop. The number of independents increase every day. Love and Light, Well, after reading the many of the comments on this thread I can see why such Lodges are attracting such interest. As for Lodges here, I personally know of no Independent ones, either in the Republic or the North.
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Post by jeddye on Jan 10, 2010 22:08:36 GMT
You know, I've been interested in joining Freemasonry for a while, but I don't really understand the difference between regular and irregular lodges... And what's with these post modern lodges? Never heard of that before. What's that all about? Welcome to the forum. Regularity is Masonic procedure that is strictly determined by each jurisdiction or Masonic order according to their own criteria. Just as no one Mason speaks for Freemasonry, neither does one organization. So, for Masons to label other Masons as "irregular" simply shows their own ignorance of Masonic protocol and procedures. If you would like more information on Post-Modern Freemasonry I suggest you check out the links in my signature as well as some of our lodge blogs. lodgehera.blogspot.comlodgenapoleon.blogspot.comWe also have a Facebook group that is dedicated to Post-Modern Freemasonry: www.facebook.com/#/group.php?gid=176863399179&ref=tsIf you have further questions feel free to post a new topic or IM me. I will help as much as I can. Love and Light, Thanks for the welcome! I'm kind of new to this type of forum, so forgive me if this is the wrong place for this question, but I was wondering: Are "Independent Lodges" the same thing as "Post Modern Freemasonry?" or am I totally off base? Are they the same thing as "Irregular" Lodges... I'm lost here. What's the difference between all these groups or sects? <(What would be the right term to use there?)
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 10, 2010 22:26:38 GMT
Welcome to the forum. Regularity is Masonic procedure that is strictly determined by each jurisdiction or Masonic order according to their own criteria. Just as no one Mason speaks for Freemasonry, neither does one organization. So, for Masons to label other Masons as "irregular" simply shows their own ignorance of Masonic protocol and procedures. If you would like more information on Post-Modern Freemasonry I suggest you check out the links in my signature as well as some of our lodge blogs. lodgehera.blogspot.comlodgenapoleon.blogspot.comWe also have a Facebook group that is dedicated to Post-Modern Freemasonry: www.facebook.com/#/group.php?gid=176863399179&ref=tsIf you have further questions feel free to post a new topic or IM me. I will help as much as I can. Love and Light, Thanks for the welcome! I'm kind of new to this type of forum, so forgive me if this is the wrong place for this question, but I was wondering: Are "Independent Lodges" the same thing as "Post Modern Freemasonry?" or am I totally off base? Are they the same thing as "Irregular" Lodges... I'm lost here. What's the difference between all these groups or sects? <(What would be the right term to use there?) Not all independent lodges are Post-Modern Freemasons. All Post-Modern lodges are independent ;D To make a long story short independent lodges are just that. Lodges who answer only to their own membership, not to some hierarchical authority. Regularity is a complex issue. Basically, regularity is the term used for Masonic best practices. For an example, in the "Mainstream" (the kind of lodge you will find in your home town) they do not admit women, require a belief in a supreme being and they hold a charter from (and are in submission too) a Grand Lodge. My lodge admits women, does not require any religious belief and we do not recognize the authority of any grand lodge. Thus, they would consider us "irregular" and visa versa. The issue with this however is that each Masonic institution ( either independent or mainstream) is sovereign of any other. So, the determination of regularity applies only to individual membership, not to anyone outside of it. most often when Masons call other Masons "irregular" it is an attempt to marginalize and hurt feelings. Love and Light,
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Post by jeddye on Jan 10, 2010 22:39:19 GMT
Not all independent lodges are Post-Modern Freemasons. All Post-Modern lodges are independent ;D To make a long story short independent lodges are just that. Lodges who answer only to their own membership, not to some hierarchical authority. Regularity is a complex issue. Basically, regularity is the term used for Masonic best practices. For an example, in the "Mainstream" (the kind of lodge you will find in your home town) they do not admit women, require a belief in a supreme being and they hold a charter from (and are in submission too) a Grand Lodge. My lodge admits women, does not require any religious belief and we do not recognize the authority of any grand lodge. Thus, they would consider us "irregular" and visa versa. The issue with this however is that each Masonic institution ( either independent or mainstream) is sovereign of any other. So, the determination of regularity applies only to individual membership, not to anyone outside of it. most often when Masons call other Masons "irregular" it is an attempt to marginalize and hurt feelings. Love and Light, Hmmm. Being single, frankly, I like the idea of a Lodge that admits women. (Hey, you never know). But would I have to be an atheist to join? Would someone who believes in God feel comfortable in those kind of Lodges? Are there any other particular advantages to one sect over another that I should know about?
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Post by magusmasonica on Jan 10, 2010 22:46:26 GMT
Not all independent lodges are Post-Modern Freemasons. All Post-Modern lodges are independent ;D To make a long story short independent lodges are just that. Lodges who answer only to their own membership, not to some hierarchical authority. Regularity is a complex issue. Basically, regularity is the term used for Masonic best practices. For an example, in the "Mainstream" (the kind of lodge you will find in your home town) they do not admit women, require a belief in a supreme being and they hold a charter from (and are in submission too) a Grand Lodge. My lodge admits women, does not require any religious belief and we do not recognize the authority of any grand lodge. Thus, they would consider us "irregular" and visa versa. The issue with this however is that each Masonic institution ( either independent or mainstream) is sovereign of any other. So, the determination of regularity applies only to individual membership, not to anyone outside of it. most often when Masons call other Masons "irregular" it is an attempt to marginalize and hurt feelings. Love and Light, Hmmm. Being single, frankly, I like the idea of a Lodge that admits women. (Hey, you never know). But would I have to be an atheist to join? Would someone who believes in God feel comfortable in those kind of Lodges? Are there any other particular advantages to one sect over another that I should know about? While I highly endorse the magical and special relationship that exists within Masonic couples I would suggest joining a gender equal lodge expressly looking for a romantic relationship is highly unadvisable. Why do you want to be a Mason? What are you hoping to gain from Freemasonry? What would a lodge gain by admitting you? These are the questions you have to answer for yourself. That is the first step in the journey. To answer your other question no, you don't have to be an Atheist. Speaking from the Post-Modern point of view, we could care less what your personal religious beliefs (or lack of) are. I would assume that we have members who are religious, it is not a typical topic of conversation. Love and Light,
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