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Post by billmcelligott on Nov 16, 2007 2:56:02 GMT
Jeff, this is what scares me.
I would want to go see if I could make them comfortable and see they are fit and happy.
Its the casting aside that I hear and see posted. New life, a New beginning is never worthwhile if it is in the wake of destruction.
You see, I do care, just can't help myself. I care about you and the members of Halcyon.
It all seems very simple to me, but then I am simple. [ for those of a delicate nature that was a joke]
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Post by antoninus9 on Nov 16, 2007 3:52:17 GMT
Bill,
I guess I'm being a little too harsh but I'm sick of all the fighting and ready for something positive and constructive to begin. Masonry needs to be fun again.
Jeff
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Post by Ziggy on Nov 16, 2007 6:27:56 GMT
Caveat emptor
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Post by mike on Nov 16, 2007 7:53:46 GMT
More info will come at the consent of our master. All brothers on the roster fall under the GL's umbrella, so all members in good standing have a GL and will be able to remain in goodstanding. We appreciate the support and understand that speculation will suffice for now, both positive and negative. Now that is a little confusing. If the members of the new unaffiliated Lodge are members in good standing of Halcyon only, that means they have just demitted. No? Does this not mean that they are now at best "unnattached" in the eyes of the GLO or even worse on a list of members about to be "expelled"for belonging to a "clandestine" Lodge. BTW I'm not attackng, just getting things clear in my own mind. M
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Post by 2 BOWL CAIN on Nov 16, 2007 8:00:01 GMT
More info will come at the consent of our master. All brothers on the roster fall under the GL's umbrella, so all members in good standing have a GL and will be able to remain in good standing. We appreciate the support and understand that speculation will suffice for now, both positive and negative. Now that is a little confusing. If the members of the new unaffiliated Lodge are members in good standing of Halcyon only, that means they have just demitted. No? Does this not mean that they are now at best "unattached" in the eyes of the GLO or even worse on a list of members about to be "expelled"for belonging to a "clandestine" Lodge. BTW I'm not attacking, just getting things clear in my own mind. M No attack perceived brother. What it means is the brothers who wish to remain in the GL o Ohio have that right. Their cards are still good. The members who turned in their cards with the charter and formed the new lodge, are no longer in the GL o Ohio. GL has our roster and the cards of the guys who voluntarily quit of their own free will and accord. I hope that clears things up. Please feel free to ask any question and I or another will attempt to answer it as best we can. Thanks again. Things will only get more interesting! only the brothers involved in the new lodge are out. all the rest are under the GL's care now, not Halcyons
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Post by penfold on Nov 16, 2007 8:16:55 GMT
Thank you all for the clarifications, can we all make a very special effort to keep this thread positive, and keep the childish comments to a minimum? We are all brothers, and should treat each other with that in mind.
Now, I see a disconnect - it has been reported that the breakaway was a result of a unanimous vote, but then we are told that those brothers who wished to remain as part of GL Ohio have been allowed to - which really doesn't make sense. Not being familiar with the home town of Halcyon Lodge, could I ask the following: Was Halcyon the only GL Ohio Lodge in the town/city? Who owns the temple that Halcyon meets in? If the lodge building was owned by Halcyon, presumably there was some form of covenant tha secured the building in the event of Halcyon's demise as a lodge, usually this is a transfer to the GL, what has been done to convert any of these existing covenants? The bretheren who have been forced to remove themselves from Halcyon's nmembership to maintain their regular masonic status, what options do they have for existing masonic lodges?
Thank you
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Post by lauderdale on Nov 16, 2007 9:22:13 GMT
" New life, a New beginning is never worthwhile if it is in the wake of destruction. " from Bro Bill
Is this not what happens in Nature? A body dies, the corpse rots, its constituent chemicals get back into the ground either directly or by the agency of insects, carnivores, fungi etc, to which it gives life from its death.
Even with man-made items the same process of destruction for rebuilding can be observed. A fine ship is built, it sails for many years, perhaps conveying cargo or passengers or possibly defending its nation as part of their Navy. Eventually its useful life is over, times have passed it by, we don't need luxury liners of that type or battleships any longer. It is scrapped. A sad event to be sure but that scrap is eventually fashioned into something else of use .
So I, as an individual, wish the Brothers of Halcyon Lodge well and admire their guts in actually doing something and not just moaning as far too many are inclined to do. Like others who have posted I trust that those Brethren who did not agree to secede have been able to find other Lodges still in Amity with the Grand Lodge of Ohio and given the size of the City of Cleveland I feel confident that this would have been the case.
Will Halcyon Lodge continue or fade away? I cannot predict and I am sure it will be difficult at first for them. However I wish them Good Luck for trying.
Bro Jeff, please keep us posted.
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Post by penfold on Nov 16, 2007 9:41:18 GMT
I see that Halcyon are based in Cleveland, a fair sized city.
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Post by middlepillar on Nov 16, 2007 9:42:36 GMT
Bro VT Mason
Thank you for your positive response.
Much appreciated
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Post by billmcelligott on Nov 16, 2007 11:05:31 GMT
Bro. Steve , I would hope it is what makes Humans different and apart from insects, carnivores, fungi etc,
They have no conscience.
I would hate to think that a Freemason would act in such a manner. I am sure they will not. But my trumpet is ready should it seem so, just in case.
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Post by brandt on Nov 16, 2007 12:04:19 GMT
Well, I can't say that I am surprised at all. Bon vent et bon chance mes fréres. Beautiful building though, I am glad that the work was done to restore it. Is there more work planned?
Brandt
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Post by 2 BOWL CAIN on Nov 16, 2007 12:44:48 GMT
Phoenix is about rebirth. It is about rising from the ashes of the past and creating a new life. It is about the regenerative capacities of our soul and spirit. The Phoenix is consumed by the flames and emerges triumphant and transformed. After each ending is a new beginning. The light returns. The Phoenix rising from the ashes is an apt metaphor for the Winter Solstice, which is a celebration of the rebirth of the sun after a long, cold, dark winter. The fire element represents male yang energy, desire, intention, enthusiasm, will, creativity, personal power, passion, action and the force of the spirit. We all have the capacity to recreate ourselves. It is never too late to follow our dreams!
"Whatever you can do, or dream you can do, begin it. Boldness has genius, power, and magic in it." – Goethe
phoenix= winter solstice Winter solstice = late december late december= halcyon days halcyon days= Legend has it the halcyon hen buries her dead mate in the winter before laying her eggs in a compact nest and setting it adrift on the sea; Æolus forbids the nest to be disturbed, so the water is calm for 14 days centered on the winter solstice, called the Halcyon Days. The phrase Halcyon days is a literary commonplace in English language and culture, signifying ideals of prosperity, bonhomie, joy, liberation, or tranquillity. hence........Halcyon= Phoenix Time to celebrate the Halcyon Days for resurfacing!
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Post by penfold on Nov 16, 2007 12:50:20 GMT
All well and good tc, are you able to answer the questions I posted above?
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Post by antoninus9 on Nov 16, 2007 14:25:00 GMT
penfold,
It was officer election night and almost all of the active members were present. They voted unanimously to surrender the charter. Several out of state members were called and they agreed as well.
The remaining lodge members haven't attended in twenty years or so and live out of state. These are the brothers TC is referring to. They were sent 2008 GLO dues cards and can do whatever they feel is best for them. I feel that many (if not all) will stay with Halcyon once they understand what happened and why.
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Post by 2 BOWL CAIN on Nov 16, 2007 14:32:08 GMT
Was Halcyon the only GL Ohio Lodge in the town/city? NO
Who owns the temple that Halcyon meets in? A grey area that cannot be elaborated on at this moment, sorry.
If the lodge building was owned by Halcyon, presumably there was some form of covenant that secured the building in the event of Halcyon's demise as a lodge, usually this is a transfer to the GL, what has been done to convert any of these existing covenants? Another grey area that is more complicated, and cannot be elaborated on at this moment, as well. Sorry.
The brethren who have been forced to remove themselves from Halcyon's membership to maintain their regular masonic status, what options do they have for existing masonic lodges? The majority of roster members live out of state and have not been in lodge in 25years. They, if paid up, will be under the GL umbrella, and have the ability to demit to another lodge, but are in good standing and are free to move about. Within the state of ohio or within the state they live. If they did not pay up, then that would be taken up with GL. GL received their per capita payment for 2008 from Halcyon, so all its members are paid for in the GL system.
Sorry I could not give more details on some of the questions, but information is a powerful working tool in this Masonic unchartered territory.
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Post by billmcelligott on Nov 16, 2007 15:51:07 GMT
The Phoenix
A phoenix is a mythical bird with beautiful gold and red plumage. At the end of its life-cycle the phoenix builds itself a nest of cinnamon twigs that it then ignites; both nest and bird burn fiercely and are reduced to ashes, from which a new, young phoenix arises. The new phoenix is destined to live, usually, as long as the old one.
The problem with this symbol is that the life cycle continues and that which replaces the Bird will in time burn and be reborn. it was adopted by early Christian as a symbol of Christ representing his resurrection, immortality, and life-after-death (1 Clement 25).
So the Phoenix always exercises humility because he knows one day he too will be gone.
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Post by 2 BOWL CAIN on Nov 16, 2007 16:06:35 GMT
Like all of us mortal beings must end. So, something dying off to be reborn anew is nothing new under the sun. =]
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Post by penfold on Nov 16, 2007 16:09:27 GMT
Thank you for your answers. Whilst I am sure you are taking every precaution to ensure that you stay within the bounds of legality I would still say check, check, check and check again with regard to the position regarding ownership of the building. It is very unlikely it is as grey as you consider it to be, and it would be a shame to see legal action instituted against the lodge and members because of an ownership distpute.
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Post by brandt on Nov 16, 2007 17:24:52 GMT
"a decision once made will take its own course." That little quote is a nice poetic way of describing cause and effect. Of course there will be effects that derive from this decision. I would project that there would be negative and positive consequences. So be it, the die is cast.
brandt
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Post by lauderdale on Nov 16, 2007 18:18:35 GMT
I would agree with Bro Brandt. As to the Legal aspects I feel that it would be most unwise for any of us here to enquire further into this as such matters are sensitive and besides this is under United States Civil Law not that of the UK and may well be very different.
Having read this thread, and knowing a bit about this matter from Bro Jeff's posts on another Forum where I used to post for a time, I would feel that this decision to go Independent of the GL of Ohio was not done on a whim nor taken lightly, but after a lot of deep thought and soul searching by the Brethren involved. It would seem that the Active Members of Halcyon Lodge are agreed on this action and that it is only the "Paper Members" who are on the roll but seldom if ever attend who may differ and even some of them favour the decision taken. I understand that USA Lodges have far larger memberships than here in the UK but that many members are irregular in their attendance or pay their subs but are seldom seen, some only joining to be able to then join the Shriners or other Orders and then are not regular attenders at the "Blue" Lodge. It would be wrong for them to block the wishes of the Active Members and I am pleased that that has not been allowed to happen, after all they are still in good standing with the GL of Ohio and can join other Lodges and be as active or inactive therein as they were in Halcyon.
It will be interesting to see how Halcyon Lodge progresses over the years and if any other Ohio Lodge follows suit..
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